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On Intelligent Design

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On Intelligent Design

I need more sleep, but I can still blog.

from JoeUser Forums

    Intelligent Design is proved by two scientific statements: Einstein's Theory of Relativity, and Occam's Razor. Basically, nothing can come from nothing, without an outside force. Therefore the universe must have been created. Occam's Razor would also prove this theory. "God created the Earth" is much more simple than any alternative. Also, any arguements for the contrary can be labled as free will (We have free will, but God must, to give us true free will, let us decide based on evidence). Also, mind you that we know nothing on the specifics of the Creation. If God willed it, we could have evolved from monocellular organisms, but, importantly, God made the universe, he knows what will happen, and anything that has or will happen has been mandated by him, as are all things happening at this time.

god jesus christ theology evolution intelligent design religion
23,158 views 162 replies
Reply #101 from Stardock Forums Top

God created us to be like a pet cat would be to us. Companionship. Except we're more like a rabid dog.

Reply #102 from JoeUser Forums Top
God created us to be like a pet cat would be to us. Companionship. Except we're more like a rabid dog.
End of quote


No. Absolutely not. Bad analogy.

God created us to be like sons and daughters are to us. We have our own thoughts and feelings, but we are still best served by being obedient to Him, because He knows better than us. But He would still let us have freedom to choose what to be obedient in.
Galactic Civilizations IV
Reply #103 from JoeUser Forums Top
God made man to know Him, to love Him


I think that's the fellowship part, Lula.
End of quote


OK, then I'm on board.  :D 
Reply #104 from Stardock Forums Top

Yeah, in hindsight, the analogy is pretty bad.

Reply #105 from JoeUser Forums Top
What do Mormons believe as far as man's purpose on earth regarding their Creator?
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You've already had this discussion with Ted. Mormons believe that God created us just like we have children - in order to become like him in every way. Not to be inferior beings, little sycophantic singing beings who suck up all day long, but to become as he is.

Romans 8:16-17.

The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

The only way we can be 'heirs of God' and 'joint-heirs with Christ' is if we can become like them.

Straight up.

[/sanchonino in this discussion]
Reply #106 from JoeUser Forums Top
Not to be inferior beings, little sycophantic singing beings who suck up all day long, but to become as he is.
End of quote


I like this point of view. :)

~Zoo
Reply #107 from JoeUser Forums Top

    Intelligent Design is proved by two scientific statements: Einstein's Theory of Relativity, and Occam's Razor. Basically, nothing can come from nothing, without an outside force. Therefore the universe must have been created.

End of quote

You will have to explain that in more detail.

 

Occam's Razor would also prove this theory. "God created the Earth" is much more simple than any alternative.

End of quote

It's not a theory, it's simply a statement. I propose the following statement, much simpler than yours:


"The earth created itself."


It triumphs over your statement by requiring one fewer player.

Your statement is really two statements:

"X created Y."

"X created X."

My statement requires only one variable, hence I have just proven that G-d doesn't exist, using your standards.

 

Reply #108 from JoeUser Forums Top
What do Mormons believe as far as man's purpose on earth regarding their Creator?


You've already had this discussion with Ted. Mormons believe that God created us just like we have children - in order to become like him in every way. Not to be inferior beings, little sycophantic singing beings who suck up all day long, but to become as he is.

Romans 8:16-17.

The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:

And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

The only way we can be 'heirs of God' and 'joint-heirs with Christ' is if we can become like them.

Straight up.

[/sanchonino in this discussion]
End of quote


Sanchonino,

Yes, by our Baptism, through sanctifying grace of the Holy Spirit Himself, we are cleansed from original sin, we become children of God, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ.

This passage doesn't mean we will be as God is...if you really believe that this means you shall become like God in every way, in other words, a god yourself...then you believe the same lie that Satan told Eve in the Garden...Gen. 3:5 "And the serpent said to the woman,....when you eat of it your eyes shall be opened and "you will be like gods..."

In Romans 8:16-17, by "children of God" it means adopted children. All of us are children of God by their creation, but Christians are children of God not merely by creation, but also by grace and union with our Lord Jesus Christ.

By "Heirs of God", an heir is one who inherits something...When Christ died we were left an inheritance and spiritual property. The inheritance is Heaven which we had lost through the original sin of Adam and regained by the death of our Lord Jesus Christ.

As to our glorified bodies, on the Last Day, at our resurrection our physical body will reunite to our soul and we will then become immortal. St.Matt. 13:34 and 1Cor. 15:44 are some Scriptural passages that describe the endowments of our glorified body. From here we all receive our Final Judgment where we will have to render a public account of our lives before Christ's tribunal. This is the way we become joint-heirs with Christ with a perfect spiritual life. While this is Mormon belief, there is nothing in Scripture that says those who are judged and go to eternal life in Heaven will become as God is or a god.
Reply #109 from JoeUser Forums Top
"The earth created itself."
End of quote


Your proposal is Evolution speak...the godScience, the ultimate authority, has spoken. It's not new, but one of those ideas that has been dogmatically indoctrinated into us as "fact".

Nothing plus nothing equals 2 elements plus eons of time equals 92 natural elements plus eons of more time equals all physical laws and a completely structured universe of galaxies, stars, planets and moons orbiting in perfect balance and order.

Godless Evolution theory....to you it can't possibly be false....but how do you know it...you simply accept it on sheer faith. The social pressure to assent to it is great...and 'educated' people can't imagine doubting it or dare to question it.
Reply #110 from JoeUser Forums Top
God made man to know Him, to love Him
End of quote


There's something else that doesn't seem to be addressed here. God has many attributes that make him God. He's all knowing,all powerful, he's a grace giver, he's righteous, he's holy, he's a God of Peace and He's also a God of love.

God, being God uses or used these attributes in His creating and watching over His creation whether it be of the world or mankind. I don't know if the word is "needs" or "chooses" but the point is God does need or choose to display these for our own good. One of these attributes is love. Not only does He desire we love him, but His desire, more than that, is to love us with an everlasting love. It's called an Agape love and is not the kind of love we really can understand. It's a God love.

I believe God created mankind to display this attribute...to love us and to have a relationship with us. He loved us so much that while we were acting like enemies towards Him, He died for us.

Since there is no greater love than sacrificial love, one willing to die for another, He perfectly demonstrated his most magnificant attribute of all.....LOVE.... not only by creating us but also by dying for us.
Reply #111 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yes, yes, yes, and yes KFC....


Reply #112 from JoeUser Forums Top
then you believe the same lie that Satan told Eve in the Garden...Gen. 3:5 "And the serpent said to the woman,....when you eat of it your eyes shall be opened and "you will be like gods..."
End of quote


Lie? Actually he was right...we are gods here on earth. We create that which did not exist. :)

~Zoo
Reply #113 from JoeUser Forums Top
We create that which did not exist.
End of quote


ya, we created all right.

Stuff like, turmoil, wrath, endless toil and needless sweat not to mention pride which begats pride etc.

some gods we are!
Reply #114 from JoeUser Forums Top
some gods we are!
End of quote


A god is not necessarily perfect or just. For a god to be a god all it needs is power...specifically over the creation or absolute control of something. :) Even the Christian God has human flaws- anger, wrath, jealousy.


~Zoo
Reply #115 from JoeUser Forums Top
Even the Christian God has human flaws- anger, wrath, jealousy.
End of quote


nope...not at all like humans Zoo. Too much to go into now tho.

His jealousy....for instance is not "of us" like we get jealous of each other. His jealousy is "for us." His desire is "for us." He is jealous "for us" because He wants His very best for us. He sees us sadly taking the wrong road and following Satan (the deceiver) instead who doesn't have our best interest in mind.

Reply #116 from JoeUser Forums Top
nope...not at all like humans Zoo. Too much to go into now tho.
End of quote


Regardless of what it's for, the emotions are still the same. He feels what we feel...from the good(love) to the bad(wrath). The reasons for those feelings are irrelevant.

~Zoo
Reply #117 from Stardock Forums Top

His anger is a righteous anger, one of rationality, not of biology.

Reply #118 from JoeUser Forums Top
His anger is a righteous anger, one of rationality, not of biology.
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My anger is quite rational. Am I God?

~Zoo
Reply #119 from JoeUser Forums Top
Am I God?
End of quote


Well, my little sister is Jesus and you're God.

Can I have a pony? I've been asking that other guy for so long, and nothing.
Reply #120 from JoeUser Forums Top
Can I have a pony? I've been asking that other guy for so long, and nothing.
End of quote


Maybe someday, SanCho...I work in mysterious ways, y'know. ;)

~Zoo
Reply #121 from JoeUser Forums Top
Can I have a pony? I've been asking that other guy for so long, and nothing.
End of quote


That's not the way God works at all!

STEAL a pony, then ask God to forgive you.

Haven't we taught you anything, SanCho? :D
Reply #122 from JoeUser Forums Top

Buy a pony, heck. You could probably afford one if you'd stop blogging all the time!

Reply #123 from JoeUser Forums Top
Buy a pony, heck. You could probably afford one if you'd stop blogging all the time!
End of quote


LMFAO. Yes, Zoo (a college student) has a problem with blogging too much. Certainly you don't have a problem with over-blogging.
Reply #124 from JoeUser Forums Top

I do have one, but I don't whine about it. Much.

I blog too much...

Reply #125 from JoeUser Forums Top
LMFAO. Yes, Zoo (a college student) has a problem with blogging too much
End of quote


It's true...I just can't stop blogging. This college stuff only serves to get in the way. Curse it!

~Zoo