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Subscription Drive: Status report

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Subscription Drive: Status report

We're not going to make it..

from WinCustomize Forums

If you click HERE you can see WinCustomize's traffic details.  Most sites keep this kind of thing secret but we tend to operate as transparently as possible.

The key figures are: 788,000 visits per day average. 5.5 MILLION visitors this past week. 

13 days into the WinCustomize subscription drive, we have a total of 345 people who have re-subscribed or subscribed new.  Quite a few of them are individuals who re-subscribed long before they needed to or bought a subscription for someone else.  That means a very small number of people are doing a lot of the heavy lifting for the site.  345 subscriptions means $6,900 in revenue (thank you to those who have subsribed).

As you can imagine, running a site that gets 5.5 million visitors every week is very expensive. Especially when it's on a download site. For instance, Kol's VistaXP skin has been downloaded about 2,000 times today.  It's a 2MB file.  That means 4,000 megabytes (4 Gigabytes) of bandwidth were used just for that one skin. So as you can imagine, the bandwidth costs of this site are immense.  Moreover, as skinning gets more popular and more users interact, we need full-time people to code and manage the site.  Thank goodness we have volunteers who actually run the site and a day to day basis or else there'd be no WinCustomize.

Which brings us back to the start of this news item.  WinCustomize costs probably around $300,000 a year to run.  That's bandwidth + salaries.  Anyone in the Internet business will tell you wer're running the site on a shoe-string.  A site in the top 3000 or so most popular in the world would typically cost far more.  deviantART, for instance, has around two-dozen employees working just on that site. 

So what happens to WinCustomize when October 31 comes and we're not even close to our goal?  Well, for skinners, subscribers, and SD Customers the answer is, not much.  Skinners and subscribers are going to get new stuff -- we have a Halloween skin in the works for instance and there will be subscriber-only content made in the future.

For regular users it's going to be a different story.  Users are going to have to start creating accounts to access skins made that month.  We'll also have to put in some code to make it more difficult for someone to simply create a duplicate account.  This will likely drive away some users -- which will be part of the goal.

In the midterm, the site will begin focusing more and more on the community with the community defined as people who care about WinCustomize.  That would be the skinners, the subscribers, and SD customers.  People not in that category will still be able to do many things on the site, but it will be much more restrictive. 

 

63,733 views 167 replies
Reply #102 from WinCustomize Forums Top
psst.. Mrs Footsie...if you don't wait too long and nobody post right after you, click the 'edit' button on your post and you can fix it.
Object Desktop - Get all of our enhancement utilities in one suite
Reply #103 from WinCustomize Forums Top
It seems like all your points assume that the purpose of WinCustomize is as a money-making venture.


I think its naive to suggest that it is not. The site is too big of a financial burden to exist as a hobbyist project. The site wants to be a cool place for skinners to hang out and the spirit you pick up on here also wants that but the reality is it's a lot more than that now. I read the post and replies. I agree, there is a big difference between wanting to make money and wanting to maintain a level of income that allows you to keep on doing what you're doing but the distinction does not change that Wincustomize is a commercial money making venture.

I've said a lot, certainly aired what I wanted to air and am thankful I was given the opportunity. The thread is straying off topic and thats partly my fault. So I'll hush now as I'm only a new user here with limited knowledge about the site and its workings. I'll let the people who really do know better than me add their comments.
Reply #104 from WinCustomize Forums Top
>> >>This subscription drive is not about catering to individual wants, but the Wincustomize community and the continuation of services, a concept that sadly seems to have been missed by a few.
>>This is exactly the kind of view that I believe holds the site back


So tell me, how is this view holding the site back? This community is made up of individuals....take away an individual and the community is still there and functional. Take away the community and you have scattered individuals with no place to go......no forums to voice opinions; no uploads or personal pages; no news or help items.....no downloads. Of course people come here to serve self interests, but the thinking has to go beyond 'pure self' or we're confronted with an unsustainable situation and the site's eventual demise. Now that was entirely my point.

There's probably others, but 3 sayings come to mind here:
No man/woman is an island, meaning that we are better off in a supportive community where we can get help with and acknowledgement for our achievements.
There's safety in numbers meaning the more of us that support Wincustomize, the better its chances of overcoming this crisis to continue providing the services so many of us use so fondly.
You only get out of life what you put into it meaning, put little or nothing into WC, get little or nothing out.

But I did NOT subscribe for "the community," but rather for the benefits that *I* receive.


Trouble is, this kind of thinking is too widespread and exactly what I'm talking about. Without the sense of community and belonging to support it, many freeloaders feel no need to subscribe when 'free' is all they're after, which in the end is self defeating because the 'free' becomes unavailable through their lack of support.
Black Cat....I'm happy that you subscribed, regardless of your reasons, and I hope you derive as much enjoyment from it as I have However, what you may see as arrogance, I see as a passion, concern and commitment to this site. Alot of subscribers are worried about its future, and that's reflected in their comments....but it surely isn't arrogance.
Reply #105 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I'm a subscriber and happy to be one, however, I think that the ideas presented for a tiered subscription basis are very feasable and more likely to gain new people and income. Why would I say this? I've forgone paying my gas bill this last month to make sure that I had my subscription with WC paid up and in good standing order. But, as a subscriber, I don't do anthing on this site other than download and make the occasional post. I'm not a programmer, skinner, and I already have my own domain and website so I don't have the time or energy to bother with the Joe User blogging or the "personal" WC site that's part of my subscription. I already pay enough each year to my hosting company for the right to have my own place on the net (with a domain name of my choosing). Am I complaining? No, however, would I have rather paid less money for the ability to download what I like (I don't rate very often as I have very ecentric tastes and very little time to make comments), and post the occasional snippet on these forums. I would have liked not to have to pay as much and not use half the "features" that are part of my subscription fee. There are lots of free blogging sites and templates, there are cheap hosting companies that you can put your own website up on. I love my WC browser and the ablitily to download how ever much I want, but the other features aren't of any use to me....hence I'm paying for somthing that I'm not using. Lower the free download limit and institute a teired subscription setting. Guarenteed that I won't have to sit in a cold shower because of a late paid gas bill and I'm betting that others would do the same
DD
Reply #107 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Perhaps implementing a tiered subscription would help to attract those who say 'but $20 is too much because I don't use this or that.' If it makes Wincustomize and everyone happy, then I'm all for it. However, there is another view to this 'I don't use it' way of thinking.....

Okay, let's put a value on the services that some choose not to use. For example: let's knock off $5 for not having a personal page; another for foregoing forum use; and another for not using the help/support pages. That leaves a grand total of $5 per subscription.

That's great, but let's also place a value on the bandwidth and skins that are used. If WC charged, say, 50 cents per skin to cover uploading, downloading and site costs, it would take only 40 downloaded skins per year to equal the current subscription price, only one more to exceed it. Now if someone comes here for purely for skins and nothing else, it would be totally unreasonable to assume they'd download 40 or less skins per subscription. The 'I don't use this or that' argument just doesn't stack up when it's viewed honestly like that.

Put simply, the services are there because Wincustomize provides them, at a cost, and if somebody opts not to use a particular one, it's not WC's fault and still a running expense which must be met to be able to offer that somebody the services they do use at a cost.

Airlines don't reduce fares because a passenger says: 'but I never watch the inflight movies, never eat the inflight meals or use the restroom'.....and even if they did, oops, long flight, no change for the airport pay toilets.
Reply #108 from WinCustomize Forums Top
my suggestions :

Allow cetain members (like apprentice or master apprentice) to have their user page, and then allow subscribers to have more features

decrease the subscription fee a little

you give away free downloads, but this is not enough, give your skinners more attractive features so that they may feel that they are SOMETHING coz you know a common user or a passerby wont subscribe at all, you need real loyal users who r satisfied with your services and wanna contribute

and so on

I really would have subscribed but i dont have a credit card
Reply #109 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I really would have subscribed but i dont have a credit card


You can pay other ways i think
Reply #110 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I believe it would make more sense to have a limit of say 3-5 downloads per day for non-subscribers, rather that a MB limit on a created account. Over at AJ's Pinmame, for example, if you're not a paying member, you get 5 DLs a day. Period. No accounts to create, no systems to circomvent. I'm not a web developer, so I'm not sure how they do it, but I think you'd have to go to the site from a different PC to get past the limit. Also, they have a minimum wait between downloads to save bandwith which is very small for paying members (30 seconds) but substantial for non-members (+/- 2 minutes). This method would also alleviate the unavoidable crush at the beginning of every month as new accounts are created and used (I think broadband users would blow their 50MB in a single day). As to the other ideas and member perks discussed in the original article, they sound great. I love this site, have subscibed since my first Stardock purchase and will continue to do so. The content and quality thereof is great, and to loose it would be a travesty! If you are a subscriber - Great Job!!! If not, please do - Wincustomize NEEDS you! ALL of you!
Reply #111 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I'm not certain that your approach would work. I for one only ever download 1 or 2 skins a week let alone a day. I wonder how many people actually download several skins everyday?

I think ultimately if Stardock/Wincustomize want the community to help keep the site going they will have to either severely limit the downloading of content or add something to the package that user cannot get at the moment.

One idea (other than introducing a tiered subs package) could be to "tax" really popular skins. So say once a skin reaches a 1000 downloads in a set period of time you could add a cost to download that skin. Maybe you could share any monies made by the download with the author. That way you wouldn't alienate skinners, but you get something back for the bandwidth used by that skin. It would'nt need to be big money, maybe something like $1.50 per download.

What do you think?
Reply #112 from WinCustomize Forums Top
"Airlines don't reduce fares because a passenger says: 'but I never watch the inflight movies, never eat the inflight meals or use the restroom'.....and even if they did, oops, long flight, no change for the airport pay toilets"

however, airlines DO reduce fares when they aren't getting their planes filled! i thought the problem here is that WC can't get enough ppl to subscribe? the present state is, these airline passengers don't even have to pay tickets, so making them pay SOMETHING should be an improvement

so let's work on that sound economic model (even though ppl keep on stressing that they're not here to make profit) of providing lower-cost services to attract MORE subscriptions, which equals high-cost services X less subscriptions. many ppl seems to be saying, WC is in trouble, so pay up & take it or lump it--but why should a casual visitor CARE? this is not about loyalty--though there are many loyal WC-subscribers, as we can see on this board & good for them--but about convenience to potential customers & how to attract more funding.

& by the way, i too am a fan of cutting free d/l to 5 per day or whatever restrictive method WC wants to use. the 50 mb limit is annoying & i would pay $10 to get rid of it & i believe many ppl would, who wouldn't shell out $20 for a bunch of things they don't need
Reply #113 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I've been following this thread pretty closely, and there have been a lot of great comments, ideas, and opinions. I particularly liked DigitalDanes' comment (#105).

It is obvious that both the most visible members of this community along with the lurkers care about it and want to see it not only survive but thrive. I also think Frogboy has made a strong argument, with little dissent, that changes do have to be made.

Normally I would refrain from making suggestions on how a corporation should do business if I am not a stockholder. I'd even have trouble inserting my opinion on how a hobbyist-community website should be run, even if I consider myself a member of that community. But the transparency Stardock allows in it decision making along with the openess of this particular group emboldens me to voice a couple opinions.

First, I think it is important that we all are discussing the same thing; it can be easy to stray (and I may do just that in a moment). The problem, as I understand it, is that WinCustomize is simply too expensive to run weighed against the benefit it provides to its primary funders, i.e. Stardock. Aside from advertising, the only other way WinCustomize can recoupe some of Stardock's investment is by user subscriptions, although the publicity WC provides for Stardock software is not negligible.

How then, can subscription revenue be increased? Frogboy asked just that in threads over these past weeks, and I think some of the current decisions are based in part on responses there. But, I'd like to add a late opinion, inspired in part by DigitalDanes.

One great thing about Object Desktop is the sheer amount of applications and perks that one gets for their money. But this is also something of a negative, because it becomes hard to describe exactly what one gets with their purchase, and difficult to cater the sales pitch to individuals--some will find certain applications useful that many will not. Most users of ODNT, I'd wager, actually only take advantage of a small percentage of what they could. A specific example, ObjectEdit, a Notepad replacement, comes with ODNT. How many people use it? I do, but a lot of you probably do not. And the fact that you get it with your purchase of Object Desktop probably did not factor into your decision to make that purchase.

So it goes with WC subscriptions. It is hard to sell people a photo gallery page or blog page, or special windowblinds/suites, or custom browser, etc. when they already have those, are happy with them, and got them for free. I think emphasis should be placed on those things a WC subscription gives you that you cannot get elsewhere. Right now that is very little, because WC allows non-subscribers/unregistered users to download so much already and it is easy (to the point that many people may not even know they are doing it) to circumvent the restrictions.

So, I think it is only reasonable to make more severe limits on what non-subscribers can download. I also think the benefits of subscription should and could be better defined and presented. Don't stress the Notepad replacement, stress the biggie--ad-free unlimited downloads from a selection of thousands of skins.

I'd like to make one last point in already this too long post. Kinda of a restatment and seconding of what others have said. The biggest expense of WC (and the cost of WC upkeep is the issue at hand) would seem to be its bandwidth requirements. We also know that WC sees an incredible number of visitors and page views. With so many people visiting and browsing through so many pages every extra byte in the code, every extra K from that unoptimized jpg preview addds up quickly. (Reminded of Richard Pryor in one of the Superman movies getting rich shaving half pennys from everyone's paycheck.) So, althoug I am not able to offer specific suggestions, I think that in addition to increasing revenue by increasing subscriptions, it would seem that there is potential to reduce cost by lowering bandwidth use. This can be done by discouraging freeloaders, as has been discussed, but I would think having the leanest, meanest site code possible would also be a big factor. (No offense to T-Man et al who I'm sure have already considered this...I just wanted to make the point).

OK. Rock on all y'all.
Reply #114 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I still say you should get some newer skins.
Reply #115 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Maybe I should say newer themes. These are 2 years old.
Reply #116 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Maybe I should say newer themes. These are 2 years old.


Thats a good point. But my thoughts are Is there any discernible difference in the quality of the skins release daily on WC and the premium skins that are for sale? I say no!
Reply #117 from WinCustomize Forums Top
If I'm reading this wrong, someone please point it out, but look at this statistic from the link Frogboy posted:

Average Visit Length 0:03

That is 3 seconds, right? 3 seconds?
3 seconds is the average length of time a visitor is on the site? That can't be right.

Because if it is, no wonder most of the visitors don't register or subscribe. 3 seconds would be hardly long enough for the site to load, much less give someone the time to decide whether to join or subscribe.

The obvious question should be how can Wincustomize keep visitors at the site longer than 3 seconds?
Reply #118 from WinCustomize Forums Top
One idea (other than introducing a tiered subs package) could be to "tax" really popular skins. So say once a skin reaches a 1000 downloads in a set period of time you could add a cost to download that skin. Maybe you could share any monies made by the download with the author. That way you wouldn't alienate skinners, but you get something back for the bandwidth used by that skin. It would'nt need to be big money, maybe something like $1.50 per download.


Remember that it is artist's work and his efforts which made a skin popular. Some skins even take months to get finalized so how can other's work can be used for making profits and if a person pays $20 for supporting WC then asking addition $$$ for using the high-rated stuff is completely un-justice with him/her.

The ONLY purpose of this Subscription drive is to reduce the weight on WC and SD being caused by the freeloaders and by those who think WC as a Free HOT CACK available to every one ... !!!!
Reply #119 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Average Visit Length 0:03


it means ... after every 03 seconds the page is viewed by a new visitor ... !!!!
Reply #120 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I really would have subscribed but i dont have a credit card

i live in a country that doesn't provide credit card yet, but i managed. now, you can, for example, wire or give the money to a good friend with a credit card, and ask him/her to pay for it for you. it worked wonders for me!
Reply #121 from WinCustomize Forums Top
it means ... after every 03 seconds the page is viewed by a new visitor ... !!!!


Thanks! Seems an odd way to denote the statistic, but your explanation sure makes more sense than a 3 second visit.
Reply #122 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I want to subscibe to wincustomize...but Iam saving up for the new windowblinds 5 I will see if I can do both I do love all that is offered
Reply #123 from WinCustomize Forums Top
One idea (other than introducing a tiered subs package) could be to "tax" really popular skins. So say once a skin reaches a 1000 downloads in a set period of time you could add a cost to download that skin. Maybe you could share any monies made by the download with the author. That way you wouldn't alienate skinners, but you get something back for the bandwidth used by that skin. It would'nt need to be big money, maybe something like $1.50 per download.


Remember that it is artist's work and his efforts which made a skin popular. Some skins even take months to get finalized so how can other's work can be used for making profits and if a person pays $20 for supporting WC then asking addition $$$ for using the high-rated stuff is completely un-justice with him/her.

The ONLY purpose of this Subscription drive is to reduce the weight on WC and SD being caused by the freeloaders and by those who think WC as a Free HOT CACK available to every one ... !!!!



I'm not sure what you mean. But remember the point of the thread is to throw some ideas around to try and help WC provide the excellent services it does now. I'm not saying i'm right just trying to help!
Reply #124 from WinCustomize Forums Top
This is my new idea on saving bandwidth/space for WC. Stop being a place for none Stardock products for downloads. No more downloads for kapsules/litestep/rainlendar/screensavers/screenshots/winamp/winmedia/firefox/etc..

Instead become a Stardock/WC hosting site only. Can you imagine what can be saved by removing those sections? Now I know that only a few months ago we all talked about expanding the sections to include IM programs and such but when push comes to shove....you have to make tough choices.
Reply #125 from WinCustomize Forums Top
This is my new idea on saving bandwidth/space for WC. Stop being a place for none Stardock products for downloads. No more downloads for kapsules/litestep/rainlendar/screensavers/screenshots/winamp/winmedia/firefox/etc..


WC is NOT SD's Skins Gallery, it is a Skinning Community dedicated to let its community members to customize Windows in a safe and un-harm way ... !!!!

If those free-loaders would have gone, WC Community would be better served ...

btw thanks for idea ... atleast you are thinking