Has the RIAA gone insane?

RIAA: Copying CDs to your iPod not protected under fair use

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/83570/ripping-music-for-mp3-players-is-not-fair-use-riaa.html
from WinCustomize Forums

In an effort to ensure that nobody is sympathetic to it, the RIAA's filing to the US copyright office indicates that it does not support people beig able to take their legally purchased CDs and copy that music onto their legally purchased iPod even if they are the only one using it.

Ripping music from CDs and transferring it to an iPod does not constitute fair use, according to a document filed by the major record companies.

In a filing to the US Copyright Office, the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA) attempts to undo a statement it made in court during the recent successful prosecution of the Grokster p2p company.

In court RIAA lawyer Don Verrilli said: 'The record companies have said, for some time now, and it's been on their website for some time now, that it's perfectly lawful to take a CD that you've purchased, upload it onto your computer, put it onto your iPod.'

However in the Copyright Office filing the RIAA takes a contrary view.

'Nor does the fact that permission to make a copy in particular circumstances is often or even routinely granted, necessarily establish that the copying is a fair use when the copyright owner withholds that authorization,' it argues. 'In this regard, the statement attributed to counsel for copyright owners in the MGM v. Grokster case is simply a statement about authorisation, not about fair use.'

In other words, explained Fred von Lohmann, senior staff attorney for the EFF, a leading digital rights campaign organisation, if you want to copy a CD to your iPod, get permission first.

As one of the people who actually does not pirate music but buys it legally, this really gets on my nerves.  At some point, EVERYONE becomes a criminal in the RIAA's book.  The idea that I can't take my legally purchased Star Wars CDs and put them onto my computer to listen to in iTunes is absurd.

21,344 views 55 replies
Reply #1 from WinCustomize Forums Top

Brad....that stance was, until just recently the EXACT LEGAL stance in Australia [and, I expect in the UK, from when much of our legal system stems].  There IS no 'fair-use' concession within Aussie copyright law/interpretation.

The difference here is that it was simply 'not enforced'.

Since the US/AUS free-trade agreements of late, between Howard and Bush...it means we have been put 'into step' with the US [they are bigger, ergo majority rules].

Our ACCC 'A-triple-C' [consumer affairs] only determined that a 'critical backup' of important WORK content was free to 'make copies of'....and music almost never would be included in that 'concession'...but a graphic/cad user could backup his Autocad or Photoshop proggies....[expensive to replace, etc].

As to whether this boat will float....probably not....as it never really did or worked in any prior copy-format...eg, Cassettes, etc...

Reply #2 from WinCustomize Forums Top
When cassettes first came out I copied all my LP's, that was legal fair use. It's no different with ipods. Seems to me that the RIAA aren't trying to keep the honest people honest, they are trying to make the honest people into criminals.
Curtains - Customize Windows with additional styles
Reply #3 from WinCustomize Forums Top
When cassettes first came out I copied all my LP's, that was legal fair use. It's no different with ipods. Seems to me that the RIAA aren't trying to keep the honest people honest, they are trying to make the honest people into criminals.


LoL, I remember that..Yeah, recording tunes for the car, travel and to give to friends so they could have some "cool tunes" as well...

The whole thing sure has become an issue, hasnt it?

"Make a copy, go to jail"

Boy that 3 strikes law really makes it interesting..LoL!!
Reply #5 from WinCustomize Forums Top
"Today the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA) has released a press release regarding the transferring of electronic music to Portable Music Players.
In part the statement says that:
"...as iTunes downloads do not go directly to the iPod (or smiliar players) the transferring of a music file from iTunes to an iPod obviously constitutes making an illegal copy of the file. it is our belief that if Apple wanted legally purchased music to be playable on the iPod, all iPods would come with preinstalled browser software and wireless modems. Furthermore, we are currently investigating whether transferring the legally downloaded file from a computer's harddisk to the computer's speakers also constitutes illegal copying."
Reply #6 from WinCustomize Forums Top
The RIAA is getting desperate. They are losing on every front...and everyone knows it. Remember that, as a company, the RIAA gets its funding from the major studios. If they don't show "results", they lose their funding, and they get closed down. So, they'll do ANYTHING to keep their jobs, of course. They really don't care about the studios that fund them, or the recording artists they are supposed to be protecting, etc.

This will get bounced on prior "Fair Use" right out of the courts. Simply put, it doesn't past the "smell test".
Reply #7 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I wanna chime in on this issue here since it got posted up here.

The RIAA has gone off the deep end and its image is so stained, so tainted, so filthy that no amount of making up will ever clean it up. There's just no point in abiding to whatever the RIAA wants the consumer wishes to do with their legally purchased music.

Let's disect the 'fair use' mentality for a bit. As mentioned, you can make a copy of a song from an LP record to be recorded onto an audio tape. And to the RIAA, that's considered fine. After all, the tapes are magnetic and the quality can degrade over time. And they also had no problem with those making tape copies for personal mixes, since the tape medium hasn't changed.

With the MP3, AAC, and WMA as compression technologies to make transporting music onto a variety of devices simple as well as space-saving, what makes this any different from the tape medium? MP3, even at its highest 320kbit/s bitrate, is still a lossy compression where audio quality is lost in order to gain such a high compression. It is the same with AAC and WMA. Both uses lossy compression where audio information is lost or discarded in order to better compress the music into smaller files. They are a digital representation of the audio tapes of long ago, except these files remain as long as the are within the confines of the audio device. They do not degrade over time. And they can very well last virtually a lifetime.

To say that I cannot take an audio CD that I have purchased and put it into my iPod is saying I cannot take any audio CD and put it into my walkman. It is atrocious and ridiculous.

On the other hand, the entire thing is moot to me, as current popular music of today tend to come and go. US music tend to be so boring and uninteresting these days. So my focus has changed to foreign music, where the RIAA doesn't have such an iron fist over what I do with music I'd have legally purchased. If the RIAA really wants to protect themselves, they need to adapt and stop being like a "Big Bully". Digital Rights Management my digital f'ing butt... what about MY rights as a music listener and customer?!

Now to go back to listening to music by Horie Yui, L'arc en Ciel, Asian Kung-Fu Generation, the pillows, Kaijura Yuki, and songs from the Jet Set Radio video game.
Reply #8 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Well this means that virtually every CD player I have violates "Fair-Use" as they do not merely "play" a CD directly, they transfer some info into a fancy schmancy "holding tank" so that it will play through even if I hit a bump.

Further, they have to go and do that ridiculous broadcasting thing where it tells me what track I'm on and how long it is.

Dang that 8 bit DAP, dang you Sony, dang you all to heck.

-El Bandito Azul
Reply #9 from WinCustomize Forums Top
You know that nice T-shirt you bought yesterday, well you only have the right to wear it in your own home. If you go outside you need to change.
Reply #10 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Suppose they did win and made it illegal to copy and impossible to copy off any CD. The next day someone would have a bootleg out that they recorded with microphones taped to their speakers. A guy at work is always talking about some movie he downloaded with people in the theater getting up and walking in front of the camera. When it comes to free quality is no object. It's all about the free.
Reply #12 from WinCustomize Forums Top
"It's so convenient to have a system where everyone is a criminal"
- Adolf Hitler

"There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power government has is
the power to crack down on criminals. When there aren't enough criminals,
one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it
becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws."
- Ayn Rand
Reply #13 from WinCustomize Forums Top
As far as I am concerned the RIAA can jump in a lake. I refuse to buy any CD until this type of behavior from them ceases. It's no skin off my back. I can listen to the radio. I'm not going to die if I don't have the recorded media at my disposal.
The only thing that is going to get their attention is if enough people boycott them in this fashion for a long enought time to SERIOUSLY damage their wallets.
Reply #14 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I wish some of the muscians the RIAA represents would speak out on this. The music industry manipulates and steals from hardworking musicians, and then attacks the people who enjoy their music. They're trying to screw as many people as they possibly can.
Reply #15 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Musicians dont care, I think. Not in the USA anyway. I have art on the internet, it's free. You can do whatever you like with it, I dont care, as long as my name is on it. I just want peaple to enjoy it. But, If some label company wants to sell it to some guy for $200.00 and give me $50.00 well hey, I was giving it away, Why not? Then lets say they want that same guy to pay 2 cents for every person who sees it on his wall, 4 cents for every copy he makes, And throws a penny my way, Cool. Then after everyone has gone to court, has gotten sued, Talked and yelled. After the laywers and special interest groups have made their money, And its all gone away- Well Ill put my art back on the internet. For Free.
Reply #17 from WinCustomize Forums Top
I remember a friend was a little irrate over something like this and went to a website dogdoo.com or something like it. There he had a package of sterile dog poo shipped in a nice package to the offending lawyer. Since it was hermatically sealed and was not a toxin and etc... it was perfectly legal. The receiving lawyer however didnt think it was funny but there was nothing he could do about it. Crude but it got the point across.

People can band together and do wonderful things, however griping isnt one of them. I find it disdainful to read about RIAA and the escalating conflict about purchased material. I but music/art/etc for my use. If I want to wipe my wifes fanny with a piece of art thats my privilege (crude but a point) or if I want to listen to my music on my computer while I am working instead of having a 500 cd jukebox to handle it, again thats my choice.

Sheep dont speak.
Reply #18 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Musicians dont care, I think. Not in the USA anyway


Missed the whole Metallica Controversay, did ya?
Reply #19 from WinCustomize Forums Top


I Guess i did, although I did listen to Garth - and "The Eagles" talk about it. Guess some folk just cant have enough money. Garth did say he was sticking up for the up and coming artist.
Reply #20 from WinCustomize Forums Top
Musicians in the US and practically everywhere else do care about it, after all it is "their art" and their way of making a living, im sure they have a concern or two about losing some of their "paycheck"...

I am not siding with the RIAA by any means, personally I think the whole thing is overblown. I would bet hard earned money that most of the musicians themselves have burned a few CD's, recorded a few tapes, etc, etc.. without "Express writtin permission" from the original recording artist....They, being in the profession, were probably some of the worst offenders..

Kinda like Gates and Piracy..LoL!
Reply #21 from WinCustomize Forums Top
If you follow this logic, then burning music to a CD (or your ipod) that you purchase off of iTunes so that you can listen to it in your car is also illegal, or at least that is where this is headed.
I am also one of those people that buy music. I use mostly use itunes. Some bands sell mp3s on their web sites as well. I spent nine months using my turntable, cassette player, as well as my PC's CD drive to transfer about 8000 mp3's onto my network so that I could enjoy them from my HTPC. Still own the turntable, all of my LPs and cassettes, as well as the CDs. Does this mean that what I have done is illegal? Sounds like a bunch of horse shit to me.
Reply #22 from WinCustomize Forums Top
remember that this article states that the RIAA "thinks" this is illegal under its "I paid for legislation, you can too!" DMCA. The courts will bounce this if given the chance.
Reply #23 from WinCustomize Forums Top
The whole thing sure has become an issue, hasnt it?

"Make a copy, go to jail"

Boy that 3 strikes law really makes it interesting..LoL!!


Lol!

I use to take legally purchased cassettes and dub specific songs onto a blank cassette for that “special tape” to help me win that gold medal in the nights Olympics with Anna.

Now I’m being told I’m a criminal and they’re going to throw me in the slammer with Bubba.

Bubba: “what’re you in for punk?”

Me: “I copied some tracks off my Oingo Boingo CD into my ipod; I thought it would help me get lucky with Anna”

Bubba: “Don’t worry sweet cheeks; you’ll be getting lucky tonight”

Yikes!

Looks like Bubba and the RIAA has the same ideas about fair use.

It’s so funny it’s like a bad Saturday Night Live skit gone awry
Reply #24 from WinCustomize Forums Top
We have been having similar discussions here in New Zealand. However, our Commerce Commission believe that coping your legally purchased CDs to you iPod/Gigabeat/whatever is covered under our "Fair Use" laws (for the time being anyway), the record industry giants aren't overly happy about it.

Just as well though, because we don't have an iTunes store, and Apple have stated they have no plans to open one here.

Here's a thought, if the RIAA do succeed in making it illegal to transfer your music to another device, does that mean that you can sue Apple, Microsoft, Toshiba etc for selling a products that have no legal use?
Reply #25 from WinCustomize Forums Top

does that mean that you can sue Apple, Microsoft, Toshiba etc for selling a products that have no legal use?

No...but you'd be entitled to a full refund, as the product failed its intended use....