Is New Orleans the new Atlantis? Should we rebuild it?

I have friends that live in New Orleans. Thank God that they safely evacuated before Katrina came blowing through.

Meanwhile, my friends, and the residents in Gulfport, Biloxi, New Orleans, and the surrounding areas that were hit will now be facing the prospects of needing months to rebuild their cities, and along with those months of time, will need billions in disaster relief, insurance payouts, and other assistance to help get things back to normal.

What I want to ask here though, is should things get back to normal in New Orleans and these other areas? Or, should we instead learn some serious lessons and perhaps instead look at New Orleans as a modern day Atlantis - a lost city that many believe was swallowed by the ocean and wiped from the face of the Earth.

Please don't mistake what I write here as being cruel, heartless and non-caring for the people that were affected by these storms. I don't want to see anyone that lost their home, their possessions, or god forbid lost a loved one or loved ones because of these storms have to endure more hardships, but at the same time, I think a little common sense needs to be brought into the picture here.

Much like the areas of California that are constantly impacted by mud-slides that cause very expensive homes to be lost (literally washed down the hills), the idea that tax money and donations to relief agencies by the bulk of the citizens in the country will go towards rebuilding things implies to me that some responsibility must be placed on the people that will have their homes rebuilt at others expense.

Would we perhaps be wise to move New Orleans, LA to say South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana, Nevada or some other safer area? I mean quite literally, would we be wise to require that anyone that gets disaster relief money from the government be bound by an agreement to move away from Louisiana, or at the very least, away from the land that was just swallowed by nature's wrath and covered with water because it was already sitting below sea level?

I know that for some New Orleans was a beautiful city, it was their home, the only place they had known, but then again, it also has been described as a city that includes many poor people. People who were working poor, who couldn't afford to move away from the area because they didn't have enough money, or didn't have a job to go to.

Given the almost complete and total devestation of the city, is it time to simply move New Orleans and put it in a much safer place, with a new start for all of it's residents?

Something to ponder....
3,305 views 38 replies
Reply #1 Top

It should be rebuilt:

1: Because we can

2: because we can do it right this time.

Reply #2 Top
We should rebuild it, but only if we can get one of those Dutch dike things, where a little boy with at least one finger is enough to keep out the entire sea.
Reply #3 Top

We should rebuild it, but only if we can get one of those Dutch dike things, where a little boy with at least one finger is enough to keep out the entire sea.

Still on the Dutch thing!  ROFL!  Ok, no French involved.  I will go for that.

Reply #4 Top
An article on CNET's News.com.com site regarding the engineering challenges involved: Hurricane cleanup could take months, years

Subtitled: New Orleans could be underwater for quite a while, according to experts, and the oil fields in the Gulf of Mexico might be under repairs for years.
Reply #5 Top
I think that should be up to the people of the affected areas and the governments involved.

Yes, we will all be paying for the decision, but, unless we are willing to shut down every disaster area just because it is prone to disaster, we would be hard pressed to find land on which to live and work.

Would we have any ports or farms if we closed every hurricane, tornado and earthquake ridden area to human habitation and investment?

The thing no one likes to talk about (except those of us who have spent more than our share of time training for, and responding to disasters), disaster mitigation, preparedness, response and recover is a major part of what drives our economy.

Now there's a seemingly "cruel, heartless and non-caring" fact of life. ;~D
Reply #6 Top
I understand what your saying.

Earthquakes, mudslides... and so forth, but there is a limit. Basically, there are plenty of areas that are beliew sealevel that are quite inhabited, but I think this area as well as some in Florida have ALWAYS been in paths of storms and such.

If they are not going to spend the money to biuld it correctly, then it should not be rebiult. My question to Dr. Guy and other is, especially after seeing how things of this matter tend to not be biult correctly or money not spent when it should, do you really think it will be rebiult right this time?

I do not believe it will be biult right this time nor any other time.


In earthquake zones you biuld for it and hope for the best, in mudslide areas, all you can really do is biuld sparingly, coastal areas that are in storm tracks; almost nothing stops water. If a town or city is below sea level and the money never seems to be there for it to be biult properly, then it should not be there. What we see o TV is the lack of design. All those lives, memories and homes gone because the area was biult knowingly below sea level and without the proper equiptmnt


This is the equilent of biulding in the desert and not having ANY WAY of bringing water.
(sorry for spelling errors)
Reply #7 Top

Yes, we will all be paying for the decision, but, unless we are willing to shut down every disaster area just because it is prone to disaster, we would be hard pressed to find land on which to live and work.

yea, what about San Andreas?  Do we abandon California?  What about New Madrid?  The bread basket?  A very slippery slope!

Reply #8 Top

My question to Dr. Guy and other is, especially after seeing how things of this matter tend to not be biult correctly or money not spent when it should, do you really think it will be rebiult right this time?

New Orleans has been spared for many many years.  But the wheel of fortune finally got them.  I think it should be rebuilt and done correctly.  If we are to abandon every disaster prone area (see above), then we are going to be giving up a lot of great land.  Did the Tsunami victims give up?

Reply #9 Top
ParaTed2k said:
I think that should be up to the people of the affected areas and the governments involved.Yes, we will all be paying for the decision, but, unless we are willing to shut down every disaster area just because it is prone to disaster, we would be hard pressed to find land on which to live and work.


... and Dr. Guy added:
yea, what about San Andreas? Do we abandon California? What about New Madrid? The bread basket? A very slippery slope!


and

New Orleans has been spared for many many years. But the wheel of fortune finally got them. I think it should be rebuilt and done correctly. If we are to abandon every disaster prone area (see above), then we are going to be giving up a lot of great land. Did the Tsunami victims give up?



I don't necessarily disagree, but there's a big IF there -- if it can be rebuilt correctly.

Personally, I've seen season after season of homes being washed off hillsides in California. Why we continue to waste money letting anyone build there is beyond me. I suppose if someone wants to waste their own money in doing so, more power to them. But asking me to pay for it, either through insurance premiums that I help pay, or through tax money, or other public efforts is really not acceptable.

The same holds for New Orleans, Miami, and many other areas.

Sure we need ports, farm land, and other real estate needs come into play too. But there is a huge mid-section in this country that could accomodate many more residents. And there's not necessarily a reason why New Orleans has to exist in the same geographic area as it previously existed in.

New Orleans had become primarily a tourist area. It's restaurants, shops and other attractions brought tourists into town. Once there, hospitality workers provided service to them, and made money from them. But, as many on the left would point out, many of the jobs in the area were low wage, long hours and basically left the employees as working poor. All of which is part of why many of the residents of New Orleans will struggle to rebuild their homes, even with assistance from the government or relief agencies like the Red Cross (and others).

If that is how things will be in the future, then does it not make sense to think about relocating the bulk of the citizens to a new area, where a new tourist haven can be built, where the whole thing could be done right from the beginning.
Reply #10 Top
If that is how things will be in the future, then does it not make sense to think about relocating the bulk of the citizens to a new area, where a new tourist haven can be built, where the whole thing could be done right from the beginning.


Which is why I said, "That is up to the people and governments involved". We don't live in a nation that tells our citizens where to live. The people who owned the property there still own it, and have every right to expect to be able to return to it. If it can't be reclaimed and rebuilt, so be it... but if it can then it is not up to anyone to tell them that they have to live in Missouri or anywhere else.

Unless you are willing to accept the government telling you where to live, don't be so quick to advocate it for others.
Reply #11 Top

Personally, I've seen season after season of homes being washed off hillsides in California. Why we continue to waste money letting anyone build there is beyond me. I suppose if someone wants to waste their own money in doing so, more power to them. But asking me to pay for it, either through insurance premiums that I help pay, or through tax money, or other public efforts is really not acceptable.

You are confusing personal disaster with national Disaster.  Build your house on sand, and watch it wash away.  Build it on stone (or bedrock) and it will survive.  There is nothing to do with the hillside manglers.  There is a lot to do with NO-Atlantis.

Reply #12 Top
Unless you are willing to accept the government telling you where to live, don't be so quick to advocate it for others.


The government tells many of us where we can live already. Thanks to environmental protection laws, wet lands in many areas are protected and can not be built on for fear it would disturb some creatures natural habitat.

To be clear - I'm not saying that the government should mandate moving the residents of New Orleans or Gulf Port, but perhaps it should be considered. What I am saying is that it would be wise to consider not spending government money rebuilding in an area that could be considered hopeless to protect.
Reply #13 Top
Apparently I'm not the only one asking this question.

Dennis Hastert (Speaker of the House) chimed in with similar questions and thoughts: House Speaker: Rebuilding N.O. doesn't make sense

House Speaker Dennis Hastert dropped a bombshell on flood-ravaged New Orleans on Thursday by suggesting that it isn’t sensible to rebuild the city.

"It doesn't make sense to me," Hastert told the Daily Herald in suburban Chicago in editions published today. "And it's a question that certainly we should ask."
Reply #14 Top

Dennis Hastert (Speaker of the House) chimed in with similar questions and thoughts: House Speaker: Rebuilding N.O. doesn't make sense

Stupid Northerners!  Where was he when Detriot was burning because of the riots?  Why rebuild a dead and decaying city anyway?

Reply #15 Top
Sure rebuild, but if most of the city is destroyed, why not just move it twenty, thirty miles north and rebuild there?

Get it north of the lake, and maybe above sea level. Similar moves have been done before with cities of antiquity after serious destruction.

This had been predicted for decades. Give them their city back, and this time make sure it has a chance to survive.
Reply #16 Top
As a coastal planner, I am very ambivilent about this. I know that there is such a huge economic incentive to build along the coast. God knows, I deal with that daily.

But, given that we are now looking at the possibility of increased tropical storms that are measurably stronger, and increasing, all due to sea level rise and global warming, I feel that maybe we should not rebuild. Return the land to the sea, where it would have been a long time ago, were it not for the levees.

Right now, there is a 100% evacuation of the city. This is the time to do it. Rebuild stuff to the north, where land may be available. I know that New Orleans has some significant historic sites and lots of..... well...... New Orleans stuff. But, will it ever be like it was? Should it be? Is New Orleans the new Pompei?

The difference between Holland and New Orleans is that Holland is not subjected to tropical storms. Sure, it has the North Atlantic seas to contend with, but they are more predictable, unlike hurricanes. If you can predict the storms, you can plan for them. Holland has done that.

I think, but am in no way convinced, that maybe the city should be cleaned out, salvage what is salvagable, and knock down the levees. Be done with it. Return it to the sea. There is a great case for that, but it would take an enormous amount of money up front. Unlike rebuilding, wherein the hole that is/was New Orleans would need continual money being thrown into it. We, as a society, need to figure out priorities. It really is a tough call.
Reply #17 Top
did anybody read that one book?

you know, that one book... the one about the three little pigs...

hmmm... i'm going to build a home... what should I build it out of? and where? there's a lot of wisdom in those fairy tales ya know...

and speaking of wisdom, wasn't it Matthew 7:24-29 that talked about the man who built his house upon the rock? the winds and rain came, and the house stood, because it was built upon a rock...

i'm not trying to insult anyone's intelligence, or get all high and mighty, but we should be smart enough to know when to say when. We're throwing good money after bad if we drop billions of dollars into rebuilding a city that's below sea level. after all, God is calling the shots here
Reply #18 Top
But, given that we are now looking at the possibility of increased tropical storms that are measurably stronger, and increasing, all due to sea level rise and global warming, I feel that maybe we should not rebuild. Return the land to the sea, where it would have been a long time ago, were it not for the levees.


Global warming, I mean the myth of gloabal warming has nothing to do with this hurricane or upcoming ones.
Reply #19 Top

As a coastal planner, I am very ambivilent about this. I know that there is such a huge economic incentive to build along the coast. God knows, I deal with that daily.

New Orleans is not on the coast.  It is 60 miles inland.

Reply #20 Top
New Orleans is not on the coast. It is 60 miles inland.


I can't stop laughing.
Reply #21 Top
I have a picture, hanging on the wall of my office, that I took the day after the Halloween Storm, 1991, of a roof laying in the surf zone. Under the photo is the Matthew quote. It says, and I'm paraphrasing, as I'm not in my office, but home with a broken leg,

"A foolish man built his house upon the sand; and the winds came; and the floods came; and the house fell; and great was the fall of it."

Where did you read that global warming is a myth? From Newsmax? Head up your ass politics, at work again.

Of course, the operative term here is "foolish man".
Reply #22 Top
I can't stop laughing.


I can't stop laughing either.
Reply #23 Top
Where did you read that global warming is a myth? From Newsmax? Head up your ass politics, at work again.


Please provide solid proof that global warming is real, because I have never seen it.
Reply #24 Top

Reply By: dabe

Thank you for proving my point.

Reply #25 Top
Please provide solid proof that global warming is real, because I have never seen it.


You haven't looked. And no, I refuse to do your homework for you, other than to suggest you do a google search for global warming. but likely, the only one's you'll believe are the crackpots who dispute it. Go figure.........

Thank you for proving my point.


You're very welcome, guy, but I was actually proving my point. For anyone to think that New Orleans is not a coastal city, is ridiculous. Patently ridiculous. Ever hear of the term "estuarine environments"? Nah, probably not.