Father of Soldier wins justice

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21566280/
from JoeUser Forums
For those of you who have been around JU awhile, there are few things that will cause the folks here to unite. Dislike of the Westburo Baptist Church, members of it's congregation and it's pastor, Fred Phelps, is one. The congregations picketing of funerals of gays and soldiers who died in Iraq has caused all kinds of outpourings of disgust and dismay from folks who think they're evil incarnate to those who just think that it gives Christians a bad name.

Every now and again, the folks that do stupid things (and the actions that Phelps and crew have taken are definitely in that category, imo) get what's coming to them. The father of one of soldiers who died in 2006 (Marine Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder) sued the Westburo Baptist Church for unspecified damages. The jury decided that it was worth $10.9 million to him. They awarded $2.9M in compensatory damages, plus $8M in punitive damages (for invasion of privacy and causing emotional distress). Whether or not he can actually collect this amount is still up in there air. The net worth of Phelps in crew isn't close to being able to cover it all at once. Also, they're appealing it, so the award might get reduced somewhat.

Now, on to the commentary!

I applaud the jury for trying to send the folks at Westboro a message. From the comments of the people involved included in the linked article, I think they're too dense (or too heavily brainwashed) to realize that their heavy handed tactics are alienating the very people that they are called to try and reach. One of them even said that a funeral is a public event.

I VERY strongly disagree with that. A funeral is a very private affair. The other key point of disagreement that I have is the funerals, for the most part, are held on private property. The cemetary and funeral home are owned by private companies, and usually a family business. As such, there is no expectation of free and public access. So, the owners are the property are free to restrict the speech rights of others on the property (even limiting access to said property).

I think that this jury award was a good thing, even if the folks that were supposed to receive its message will only respond to catching a 10lb sledge across the side of the head.
4,338 views 9 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top

On one hand, I do nto like limitations on free speech.  On the other I applaud this award (it will be cut, but hopefully not eliminated).

Yes, funerals are private affairs, and that is where Phelps went wrong.  it is not the government infringing on his right of free speech, but private citizens basically telling him he is not wanted at their private affairs, which is as important a concept as free speech - the right to free assmbly (same amendment too).

There is a time and place for discussion and disagreement.  That is something that too many people have yet to learn.  Free speech is free in what you can say, but as a right, it must not be perverted and used as a hammer to drown out all other activities in a free society.

Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
One of them even said that a funeral is a public event


I think these people are confusing the idea that a cemetery is a place where anyone can go to see a family member, an old friend or just remember someone they know or heard of. That, however, does not mean they are free to go to other peoples funerals just because they are allowed inside the cemetery. That is just plain wrong. What ever gave people the idea that a protest was meant to annoy the hell out of people as oppose to making a point?
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Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
I was glad to see this too. I feel horrible for those family's who have lost a son or daughter and then have to see this group with their hateful signs when they are trying to say goodbye. It's shameful.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
I applaud the award, but wonder if a penny of it will ever get paid.  I'd love to see this really make a difference, but so far the losers of the suit are sounding like they won't change a single thing they do and will continue to make nuisances of themselves whenever and wherever possible.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top

To me these "people" are no different than those who stand outside of Mormon Temples while marriage parties are celebrating on the temple grounds.  They yell obscenities and call the bride a whore, all in the name of "Christianity".

Political and religious speech should be protected, but there is no Constitutional right to harrass people on private property or spew hatred for the sake of hatred itself.

They have the right to hate anyone they want, their leaders also have the right to preach hatred, but they do not have the right to infringe on the privacy rights of their victims.

 

Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top

To me these "people" are no different than those who stand outside of Mormon Temples while marriage parties are celebrating on the temple grounds.  They yell obscenities and call the bride a whore, all in the name of "Christianity".

Political and religious speech should be protected, but there is no Constitutional right to harrass people on private property or spew hatred for the sake of hatred itself.

They have the right to hate anyone they want, their leaders also have the right to preach hatred, but they do not have the right to infringe on the privacy rights of their victims.

 

Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
"To me these "people" are no different than those who stand outside of Mormon Temples while marriage parties are celebrating on the temple grounds. They yell obscenities and call the bride a whore, all in the name of "Christianity"."

I didn't know people did that.

JOB 13:5
"If only you would be altogether silent! For you, that would be
wisdom."

EPH 4:29
"Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what
is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may
benefit those who listen."

Even if Mormons were the human equivalent of pond scum, which I'm definitely not saying you are, but even if they were it would not be right to say such things.
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
you are aloud free speech as long as you don't set out to cause a riot or cause a fight. going to a funeral does both of those.
Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
  I meant to comment on this a while back! I'm glad they got 'kicked' in the teeth so to speak! What they do [Phelps and his crowd] is cowardly and heartless! I'm glad the dad stood up and did something, let's hope more people will do the same!