Airlines and Security get it right....for once

Maybe instead of playing haunted house on an airplane, they should be out denouncing the real terrorists.  Then the next time, people wont jump when they say boo.

Oh come on.  You know we can't offend anyone anymore. 

Oh come on. You know we can't offend anyone anymore.

Is terror offending people?

Either provide links to your claims, or i'm callig BS.

Double Post

MSM link - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15824096/

More thorough article about their behavior - http://www.washtimes.com/national/20061128-122902-7522r.htm

Air marshal, security story - http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20061129-121812-1240r.htm

 

Thank you, I will read them asap.

Seems like a good plan to make things easier for their bombers to get onto planes. Pretty fart smellers.

If it was a stunt, then they were being suspicious enough to get "detained" thats on them. Praying loudly so as to attract attention to yourself, while not in itself suspicious, rude but hardly suspicious, how suspicious I don't know I wasn't there but nobody prays out-loud so as to attract attention.

Combined with the other behaviors, gathering in groups at the front and rear of the plane, as well as switching seats; That is all valid observational and behaviors like that especially if they are meant to intimidate other passengers, that can be looked at as disorderly conduct. I'm curious as to whether there was enough evidence to charge them with disorderly conduct.

"Sounds perfect right? Purposely get yourself kicked off an airplane, claim "racism", and try to make it illegal for people to report suspicious behavior just because they might be islamic."

If there is suspicious behaviors, not a single one but a combined and concerted effort by some then your duty is to report it. Regardless of racism or not, it's not profiling if you report suspicious behavior that might be a crime. What's a crime is reporting something when there is nothing suspicious about the behaviour. In this case from what I have read, clearly something was up and the people on the plane did the right thing.

If racism/Islamist extremistismshanism lol comments are what could be considered here's an example...

"Would you be more likely to have an anxiety attack at 20,000 feet if the passenger seated next to you was: A) An Irish nun saying the Rosary? A Mormon missionary in regulation white shirt and narrow, black tie? C) A Hari Krishna in a standard-issue saffron robe? or D) A bearded bloke of Middle Eastern complexion holding a well-thumbed Koran?"

Specifically D. A bearded bloke of Middle Eastern complexion holding a well-thumbed Koran?

This sort of crap is what people pass off as acceptable criteria for designating people terrorists. Which one is more likely then the other. If it were only that easy.

I'm going to watch the links now.

The articles you posted so far, seem to agree that there was an incident, but not necessarily on the suspicious behavior. None of the text or video, states as your post does.

"they would gather in the front and back of the airplane" They seated themselves in the front middle and back, but there is no mention of gathering as if in a group, maybe that's not what you meant though.

Also not in the post, they apparently stood and prayed outloud, which is distruptive at best, and qualifies as disorderly conduct, you don't do that on a plane, downright scary at worst in this situation, evidently with the other behaviours it was scary. I didn't read that in your post.

They also asked for seat belt extensions, though they weren't obese or large, and they didn't use them as they are used, but placed them on the floor of the plane. Weird.

Was this all a staged act? Was it a setup for a lawsuit? Was it a setup to grab media attention and uncover some of the treatment of Muslims in general that seems to fly under the radar of the media. Was this a potential terrorist attack?

When asked to leave, they declined, so they had to be removed by police.

I think most likely, this was just a few guys who don't fly frequently and who scared the hell out of other passengers, who are already frightened to fly given the terrorism climate on the planet. At least the passengers had some suspicious activity to call on, and not just merely the fact that these guys were Muslim. It's unfortunate they chose that time and place to do what they must know would scare or at the very least make other passengers uncomfortable. Prayer while standing, not in a church but in an airplane disrupts people. The fact that you are Muslim, and doing it, along with the other strange things that have been suggested, makes it frightening for Americans. Right or wrong, it does right now. But perhaps that was the whole point. To uncover our own fears and make us face it, right or wrong. These guys may also have been very well aware and conscious of their behavior and planned this, again to make us face the fear and either rationalize it or dump it.

To date, these men have not been charged with a crime, am I right about that? They didn't do anything wrong except be disruptive, and not cooperate with the flight staff, evidently two of them sat in first class. They performed suspicious actions, but they didn't break any laws, just misdemeanors at best.

As for the airlines, they did what they had to do, which is get the disruptive passengers off the plane, get the plane in the air and en route to its destination. Whether or not the crew did it's job professionally, as I believe they have, at least from what I've read/seen so far, that will be borne out in further reporting.

"they would gather in the front and back of the airplane" They seated themselves in the front middle and back, but there is no mention of gathering as if in a group, maybe that's not what you meant though.

From what I have read in other articles is that they would "group up" in two's and one set would stand at the front of the airplane, and another at the back.  That is what I meant.

The real point of this is how people like this perform this stunt in order to proclaim "racism" and try to intimidate and scare people into not reporting suspicious behavior because someone is muslim. 

 

Perfect example, and now a democrats has weighed in.

The protesters also called on Congress to pass legislation to outlaw passenger profiling. Rep. Sheila Jackson-Lee, Texas Democrat, said the September 11 terrorist attacks "cannot be permitted to be used to justify racial profiling, harassment and discrimination of Muslim and Arab Americans."

One of six Muslim imams pulled from a US Airways flight in Minneapolis last night by federal authorities is affiliated with a Hamas-linked organization and acknowledged a connection to Osama bin Laden in the 1990s. Omar Shahin, who served as a spokesman for the clerics, is a representative of the Kind Hearts Organization, which had its assets frozen by the U.S. Treasury pending an investigation, notes Islam scholar Robert Spencer on his weblog JihadWatch Treasury spokesman Stuart Levey in February said KindHearts "is the progeny of Holy Land Foundation and Global Relief Foundation, which attempted to mask their support for terrorism behind the façade of charitable giving."

http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=53057

My God, Dan, is there any Muslim activity that you won't act as an apologist for?

Is there any Muslim you won't bash, that you won't hate? That's all i see lately, is "oh, he/she's a muslim...." Then followed by the torches and pitch forks.

is affiliated with a Hamas-linked organization and acknowledged a connection to Osama bin Laden

So? Has he done anything even remotely terrorist like?

If racism/Islamist extremistismshanism lol comments are what could be considered here's an example... "Would you be more likely to have an anxiety attack at 20,000 feet if the passenger seated next to you was: A) An Irish nun saying the Rosary? A Mormon missionary in regulation white shirt and narrow, black tie? C) A Hari Krishna in a standard-issue saffron robe? or D) A bearded bloke of Middle Eastern complexion holding a well-thumbed Koran?" Specifically D. A bearded bloke of Middle Eastern complexion holding a well-thumbed Koran? This sort of crap is what people pass off as acceptable criteria for designating people terrorists. Which one is more likely then the other. If it were only that easy. I'm going to watch the links now.

That's something I've noticed, there's an over all fear of islam. The average american seems to think that the Muslim next to them just might do something...

It's sad, and horrible. It's fucking despicable.

~L

September 11 terrorist attacks "cannot be permitted to be used to justify racial profiling, harassment and discrimination of Muslim and Arab Americans."

What an asshat. When Irish nuns and Baptist preachers start hijacking or blowing up planes they should be profiled as well. Right now it's Middle Eastern Muslims so damn right they should be profiled. Doing otherwise is just plain stupid. But then, it was said by a Leftist so...

But then, it was said by a Leftist so...

Ya know, the day the "righties" become the spurned...the "loons" etc...

I'm going to sit back, and laugh, because "O how the tables have turned..."

 

So? Has he done anything even remotely terrorist like?

Supporting a terrorist organization is something terrorist-like. 

 

That's something I've noticed, there's an over all fear of islam. The average american seems to think that the Muslim next to them just might do something...

Not fear at all, but the average American knows what islam is capable of. 

Supporting a terrorist organization is something terrorist-like.

Okay, so i support our troops, does that mean i supported what those soldiers did at Abu Graib? Or, cause i support our military, does that mean i support WHIMSEC/SOA, where they train foreign governments individuals in interrogation techniques that are torture?

No.

So, until I see them suicide bombing, or training terrorists....*shrugs*

Granted, if they do the former...then everything is taken care of.

Not fear at all, but the average American knows what islam is capable of.

Fear, capabilty.....meh,the thing is...if it gets to a certain point, it's called paranoia.

Ya know, the day the "righties" become the spurned...the "loons" etc... I'm going to sit back, and laugh, because "O how the tables have turned..."

That assumes they are as stupid, a very faulty assumption.

That assumes they are as stupid, a very faulty assumption.

*shrugs* I'm still going to laugh, whether they are stupid or not.

Okay, so i support our troops, does that mean i supported what those soldiers did at Abu Graib? Or, cause i support our military, does that mean i support WHIMSEC/SOA, where they train foreign governments individuals in interrogation techniques that are torture?

That is the most ridiculous thing I have read all day.  You are going to equate supporting American soldiers to that of an organization like Hamas? 

 

Look I'm not apologizing for sh*t. Whip you can re-read my post and just take a pill.

It wasn't immediately clear from the post what this is/was.

What I read in the post, and was I read in the attached links and saw on the video was a bit different. The first post was before I saw any articles except the post, remember I work nights so I didn't get to hear them all talk about this last night on the media endlessly so kiss off.

If you had read and then re-read the fu*king quote whip maybe you'd get that but you are too busy bashing anybody wearing some garb and not jeans, and knocking me, whenever I suggest we treat Americans as Americans instead of "terrorists"

Remind me where and how these guys have committed a crime? Were any weapons carried on board? Did they bring a bomb? Did they scream bomb on the plane? No they're guilty of scaring people that's it. If you weren't so damn willing to be scared, to be terrorized then nothing they had done would even have us talking about it. Save the suspicious behaviour.

"Air marshals, pilots and security officials yesterday expressed concern that airline passengers and crews will be reluctant to report suspicious behavior aboard for fear of being called "racists," Air marshals, pilots and security officials yesterday expressed concern that airline passengers and crews will be reluctant to report suspicious behavior aboard for fear of being called "racists,"

That's what was quoted in the post, and what's cloudy about that? They expressed concern that people in the future, since they haven't charged these guys with anything, will not report suspicious behavior in the future for fear of being labeled a "racist". I'm expressing concern on that too. If you or I were flying and this was going on yeah they're be a hell raised by me and that plane would never have left the tarmac with me on it, with these guys doing this.

How do you know that they weren't just infrequent fliers participating in their daily prayers? How do you know? I don't know, doesn't look that way, but it doesn't necessarily not look that way either. Part of the reason I tend to cut the people, the citizens of the United States, on the airplane some slack, is that they had every right to be on that plane as anybody else, and to pray too.

It is becoming more and more clear this was a stunt. But what of it? Why won't you face the fear and deal with it? These guys very well may have just become so sick of the scapegoat that is Islam and airplanes, that they may have just decided to hell with you guys and launch their own little airplane protest. This could become a national trend if people don't stop labeling Muslims "terrorist" at every opportunity. Imagine if every Muslim that boarded every plane in this country daily did this, just to prove the point that you are scared of your fellow citizen and for what good reason? Paranoia? Are not all passengers not screened before boarding a plane? Is not the cockpit of every American civilian aircraft unimpreginable, is there not a fair shot that U.S. Marshalls are flying on the jet with you? Would not nearly every male and most female passengers on board fight tooth and nail against anybody Muslim or not who didn't sit down and shut the hell up for the flight but stormed the front of the plane or started taking hostages.

Your FEAR is both illogical and childish and whats wrong with this is, Americans in general thinking it's alright to treat Muslims in general like they are bad, evil, and out to get them.

That said. These guys were acting suspicious, I haven't decided because it's too early in the news cycle to know what really happened, they haven't offered an interview to my knowledge, no crime has been committed that I am aware of, all you got is Muslims acting suspicious on a plane, either intentionally or unintentionally what is fact right now, is at no time were any passengers in danger on that plane in any way. These guys if guilty of anything are of disorderly conduct, and refusing to cooperate with airline staff. The airlines can ban them, but as to whether or not that's a crime, well you look it up and tell me.

I know disorderly is, but I doubt refusing to cooperate with airline staff is a crime. Maybe a federal screener but they obviously made it on the plane.

Island Dog, why don't you ask uh who is it Paladin? He's an expert on how we have followed, to the letter, the UCMJ and all the "laws on torture" to train foreign governments to use it.

The military might not be engaging in it, but that leaves the CIA, and anybody working side by side with a foreign government who could give a sh*t less about a persons' rights overseas, we'll not ever know about it, because if you are a detainee you don't have a right to a trial or even know what you are accused of. We don't even need to prove an enemy combatant is an enemy, just that they were there when we rounded em up, locked em up threw away the key.

These "imams" are evidently priests, they prayed before the flight, maybe for good weather lol, and while on board the plane.
"The imams boarded the plane individually, Shahin said, except for a blind member who needed assistance. They didn't sit together and "did nothing," he contended."

One of the guys was blind, yet they still thought he'd be a credible terrorist. I suppose American quadriplegic who prays on a plane, and wears a turban is as good as a "terrorist" too huh Whip?

That is the most ridiculous thing I have read all day. You are going to equate supporting American soldiers to that of an organization like Hamas?

Yes, I am. Both do a duty, which they have sworn to do, for one reason or another.

That is the most ridiculous thing I have read all day. You are going to equate supporting American soldiers to that of an organization like Hamas? Yes, I am. Both do a duty, which they have sworn to do, for one reason or another.

One kills innocents - that is their mission. The other kills killers - that is their mission. That you equate them shows how immature and naive you are. And stupid.

One kills innocents - that is their mission. The other kills killers - that is their mission. That you equate them shows how immature and naive you are. And stupid.

Correction,

One is to fight for/defend Islam, under their caliph or such.

One is to fight for/defend their country, under their commander and chief.


See?

Oh, and doc...if i was immature - then why is it that you do the same? You've been childish, and immature. Such as, on KFCs thread, remember?

Second, I am not stupid, nor am I naive on this. I may be naive about some things, but i've done my reading and research, this is my opinion on it.

Since we're talking about being naive/ignorant, then I could easily say that you are naive/ignorant about me, LW, bondage, and other topics...

Shall I? I won't, because i won't stoop that low.

Just because i don't "go with the flow," doesn't mean I am immature. Funny thing is, i have many people...my professors, my family, my friends (many whom are years and years older than myself), people i know online....who all say i am mature.

So Doc, I say you are wrong.