Gideon MacLeish Gideon MacLeish

I really Don't Care to "Understand" Terrorists

I really Don't Care to "Understand" Terrorists

Many years ago, Ted Bundy was executed. While I'm not particularly a fan of capital punishment, some executions disturb me less than others, and Bundy's was one of those. I believe that most Americans would generally agree with me on that point.

It would have been utterly disturbing to imagine someone going into Bundy's cell to ask him what he wanted, and how we could have accomodated his wishes. Bundy deserved no such consideration, and the mere suggestion that he did would have evoked a LOT of outrage across the country.

Yet the current vein of PC thought has us geared to do exactly that with terrorists. While some bloggers on the site have pointed out that if we don't have the stomach to slaughter the Islamic extremists outright, we have to face the fact that we must negoitiate with them. But that negotiation should not include acquiescence to their outrageous demands.

There are far too many who think that an Islamic terrorist who straps bombs to themselves is somehow the same as a Christian who preaches on the street. That assertion is not only utterly ludicrous, it is sad indeed. While it is true that some extremists who call themselves Christians could, with the right catalyst, be driven to such actions, the fact that such examples are not really widespread in the 2000 year history of the faith should indicate that it's not a key tenet. And, while I realize the claims of those who would say that Mohammed himself advocated the same level of terrorism are widely debated, it is reasonable to say you can find more support for the terrorist mentality in the teachings of Mohammed than you can in the teachings of Christ.

Whether Christian, Muslim, atheist, what have you, murderers are murderers, and it is not our duty to "understand" them, or to try to "heal" them. They've proven their unfitness to be an active part of our society, and, while we don't necessarily need to execute them, we certainly don't need to try to "understand" them.

 

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Reply #26 Top
idiot
Reply #27 Top
Apocalyptical cult groups seek the destruction of New York City and Toronto

www.agoracosmopolitan.com/home/Frontpage/2006/10/10/01242.html

Reliable sources suggest that it is apparent that fascistic "pseudo-Christian" cult group(s), and not apparent Muslim scapegoats, were responsible for the 9-11 attack on the World Trade Center.

America is popularly acknowledged as the world's only Superpower, with by far the world's best intelligence capability. That is further supported by a vast network of corresponding intelligence, and police investigative capability including INTERPOL, from its allies.

No Muslim rogue group or Islamist government had any chance of the Herculean bringing down the World Trade Center, undetected from these agencies. Furthermore, the World Trade Center was also built to withstand aeroplanes being crashed into it, and other similar terrorist schemes.

The aeroplane Hijackers associated with 9-11 could be viewed to be little more than employees hired for their apparent Muslim cultural heritage, who were being manipulated by a much more technologically sophisticated plot, than could ever be executed by any 'Muslim radical' group.

Having dismissed the credibility of the official claim that Muslim extremists could ever have launched a scheme to bring down the World Trade Center undetected, then what kind of group would seek to bring down the World Trade Center? The psychological profile of the mastermind of the World Trade Center, and the corresponding Washington D.C. attacks suggests a well-financed pseudo-Christian cult, with Neo-Nazi affiliations.

Apocalyptical "pseudo-Christian" cult groups apparently applauded the destruction of WTC. In their apparent view, the World Trade Center was a modern day "polyglot" version of 'Tower of Babel' in a city of "mongrel races" and "sinfulness", reminiscent of Babylon in the Bible.

The World Trade Center (WTC) was a symbol of the financial success of New York City, as America's financial capital. Jews were persecuted in Nazi Germany for being an "inferior race" that presided over a "Conspiracy" to take-over the world using their financial power, in part, to create "morally degenerative cultural products" symbolized by today's film industry which is attacked by "neo-cons". The WTC would therefore make a prime target for any Neo-Nazi-inspired group, which sought to begin a racial "purification" against "Jewry", and its "permissive" institutions expressed in NYC, and that were viewed to have led to the weakening of America. These despised institutions include human rights, peace, and environmental groups led by Jews, and which in turn support the activities of other "inferior races". "Grassroots" U.S. -based Neo-Nazi groups applauded the destruction of the WTC in the aftermath of 9-11.

Goro Adachi remarks in Etemenanki, "How fitting is it that it was the twin towers -- by far the tallest in the city -- of the "modern Babylon", i.e. NYC, that were destroyed in the recent terrorist attacks?" He further stipulates that "NYC is the ultimate melting pot of all peoples of this planet where they interact in harmony (well-exemplified by New York City being the home of the United Nations) and produce something -- just like the builders of the Tower of Babel. And even the designation of 'whore', Adachi indicates "is quite applicable as at the entrance of that city is found a welcoming Statue of Liberty, a "sinful" woman symbolizing the city."

Adachi also indicates that "Esoterically, Sirius is represented by a five-pointed star, i.e. a pentagonal form -- thus ending up strongly resonating with the fact that the '9-11' terrorist attacks hit not just the WTC towers but also the Pentagon (whose construction, by the way, began on 9-11)." Adachi further indicates that, "Sirius, moreover, may be considered a 'stargate' par excellence for in ancient Egypt 'star' was interchangeable with 'doorway'.

Sirius being the brightest star in the night sky, it can thusly be viewed as the ultimate 'gate of heaven', or 'gate of the god' - which just happens to be the very meaning of the name 'Babylon'. Similarly, the name given to the historical Tower of Babel, Etemenanki, meant 'the house of the foundation of heaven and earth', i.e. a gate to heaven." Adachi further observes that,"This link is then further enhanced by the fact that the name 'Magdalene' (as Magdala) the alleged lover of Jesus, can mean 'tower' as in the Tower of Babel and the [former and now destroyed] WTC twin towers."

These "pseudo-Christian" confederates are apparently ideologically linked with groups seeking a "New World Order". These groups apparently view the destruction of the WTC as only the first "salvo" for their apparently contemplated destruction of the whole of New York City as a "city of sinners", in a scheme that can be blamed against "Muslim extremists". The first "salvo" was apparently, to create a context of fear among the populace against an identified "enemy" in the form of oil-possessing Muslims, which could legitimate the destruction of rights in a democracy of "mongrel races".

The criminal profile of the mastermind associated with 9-11 shows a calculated tactician which will "return to the scene of the crime" in order to inflict much more destruction, like a megalomaniacal serial criminal.

Once the Muslim extremists can be blamed (in a similar manner that Adolf Hitler's Nazis blamed the Jews), for the destruction of New York City, and other targets, under the contrived pre-text of a "War against Terrorism" then a sought "Race War" can escalate. Apocalyptical groups seek to galvanize a "Race War" against inferior Muslims races, involving nuclear strikes, toward a "racial cleansing". Various openly practicing and underground racist organizations in the U.S., some of which are very well-financed, have had a long history of viewing the inevitability of "race war".

Apocalyptical groups apparently seek the destruction of New York City because it embraces the spirit of American liberty that has been "misplaced" in the hands of its "sinful mongrel races". The destruction of Toronto is similarly sought by Apocalyptical groups because of its mongrel races associated with the world's most "multicultural city", that "must" be destroyed to give way a "god fearing" Aryan "North American Union".

Within this context of the apparent prism of the Apocalyptical mastermind associated with 9-11; once Toronto is simultaneously attacked, along with other targets like Montreal and Ottawa, the Harper government will then be in a position to "invite" U.S. troops under pre-text of Security Agreements signed by the Martin government with the Bush regime in 1995.

In a "North American Union" which is sought by 2007, the Constitutions of the U.S. and Canada are to be replaced by a military-political-complex guided by religiously fascist values mis-attributed to the Bible's Book of Revelation. The "North American Union" is to be a further strategic step toward joining with Europe in a "New World Order", as Free Trade Agreement between Canada and the U.S. in the mid-1980's had inspired "Globalization". Apocalyptical groups seek to fulfill Adolf Hitler's sought goal of the "unification of the white race", and the subjugation of other "inferior" groups which include "coloured" Muslim groups, in labour camps. Some groups like 'Prison Planet' allege that labour and concentration camps, in fact, have already been built in preparation of a state of anarchy caused by the anticipated destruction of cities like New York in U.S. and Toronto in Canada, ensuing nuclear strikes against "Islamist" targets, and a sought "race war". Apocalyptical groups seek a "New World Order" presided by a ruling elite of Aryan descendants of great "European warriors" who will "fulfill the Book of Revelation" by ushering in 'Judgement Day' against inferior races that are "destined" to serve the "master race".


video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1311376419456445291
Reply #28 Top
I know many people don't care to but in order to understand your enemy you HAVE to. In order to win the war and know what to do AFTER you win the war, you HAVE to.

"While some bloggers on the site have pointed out that if we don't have the stomach to slaughter the Islamic extremists outright, we have to face the fact that we must negoitiate with them. But that negotiation should not include acquiescence to their outrageous demands"

We should negotiate on good terms when applicable (as in, when it benefits us to do so), full well knowing that negotiation with terrorists of this day and age is really impossible because they really want us gone period. But this negotiation buys us time, lets us talk to people who are not as crazy as the movement wants us to believe, and so forth.



You see, understanding the terrorists gives you the heads up on what you should plan. In fact, since the terrorist tend to be of a simple solution (destroy America), it actually makes it EASIER to know the direction they are going in and how to devert it.

You can head it off, you can devert it, you can estimate when it will hit critical mass... oh I so disagree with you, understanding terrorist is a top priority. Understanding where they come from, what gives them birth and so forth will end the war in 10 years, maybe 20.

Or you can go the Isreal route and have a perpetual state of emergency until people get tired of it (usually after generations have lived through it) of which can take 100 or more years.

All I am saying is that you have to knw who your enemy is. Period.





I should get back into my history books. Allot of what I see happening now is a repeat of what has happened before. If I could only remember where I have seen this exactly. Rome? Refered in Biblical text? I know Iv'e seen it a few times. Even how the Iraq war was handled should have been done better because of what we should have learned from WWII, the Korean War and Vietnam.
Reply #29 Top
"So you would say we have to understand the Ted Bundys the Richard specks, before we could condemn them? Is that what you are saying?

Sorry, I dont have to understand a cockroach before I squash it. Maybe you need to understand a Charlie Manson or a Juan Corona before you eliminate them from society?"

Wow... how did I miss this one...

So what you are basically saying is that Ted Bundy and Richard Specks NEVER were born as babies? They just all of a suddent became Ted Bundy? They all of a sudden became Richard Specks? Is that how you think this works?


Look, not caring about them and not trying to understand them is 2 different things. Just because you try to understand where it comes from and why doesn't mean you care or like the acts or the person committing them.


Do you know how crime in a city falls? Through investigation, patterns and getting to know the criminals and the neighborhood(s) they live in or commit crimes in. By your logic, we would never try to see patterns, logical next steps to altering crime or even stopping crime waves before it can happen. The Mafia would still exist under you logic because you would NEVER try to understand how they work and why people support them.

By you logic, America would have to do everything on is own even though we all know we are part of a global economy that demands co-operation. We can't even get North Korea to stop testing because we can't get China to work with us... but if we knew why and understood why or try to figure out what our next step should be based on understanding the enemy, things might be a whole lot smoother than 'they are evil'





So please, try to explain to me how understanding the problem will not help to finding the solution?
Reply #30 Top
I Understand the terrorist just fine, and there is no problem that a serious nuke will not fix, FAST!
Reply #31 Top
www.angus-reid.com/polls/index.cfm/fuseaction/viewItem/itemID/13469

- Many adults in the United States believe the current federal government has not been completely forthcoming on the issue of the 9/11 terrorist attacks, according to a poll by the New York Times and CBS News. 53 per cent of respondents think the Bush administration is hiding something, and 28 per cent believe it is lying.

Only 16 per cent of respondents say the government headed by U.S. president George W. Bush is telling the truth on what it knew prior to the terrorist attacks, down five points since May 2002.

Source: The New York Times / CBS News
Methodology: Telephone interviews with 983 American adults, conducted from Oct. 5 to Oct. 8, 2006. Margin of error is 4 per cent.

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It is evident to me that the United States government believes that any individual or group of people that works to prevent it from implementing its agenda are terrorists. Furthermore, I contend that the government’s plan is not the people’s agenda; but some of us will be required to sacrifice our lives in order to help them execute their will, and all of us will be required to sacrifice our freedoms.

I also contend that the government overwhelmingly represents the interests of wealth and power; that its strength is derived from corporate bribes, rather than from grass roots populist support; that it exists to execute a Plutocratic agenda of world domination, while neglecting the needs of the overwhelming majority of the people.

I charge that the government is engaged in immoral and criminal conduct on a global scale. That it does not conform to the norms of civil society; that it is sociopathic, and flagrantly violates domestic and international law. The form of government that we have does not serve the citizenry—it preys upon them. It is not a government of the people, for the people. It is government of the corporations, for the corporations, by the corporations—a corporate Plutocracy.

The sole purpose of Plutocratic government is to spread the gospel of free market economics and privatized wealth, and to extend the hegemony of capitalism to every corner of the earth. Its god is the almighty dollar. Championed by right wing extremists, it is equally endorsed by cowering neo-liberals in Congress. Its funding is derived from corporate sources and extorted tax contributions from the citizenry.

I contend that the government routinely breaches the Constitution and the Bill of Rights that it was sworn to uphold; and that it circumvents domestic law through the frequent use of presidential signing statements that effectively render civil law null and void. The recent passage of the Military Commissions Acts that resulted in the suspension of habeas corpus, passed into law with the aide of fourteen Democrats, is beyond onerous—it is morally vacuous and criminal.

The executive branch of the government, in particular, has run amok; it disdains the daily struggles of ordinary citizens, and is engaged in class warfare against its own, and the world’s working people. It conducts terrorist attacks on its own citizens, and against civilians abroad.

It is widely known abroad that the U.S. government is practicing extraordinary rendition in order to torture, maim, and kill its suspected enemies; it imprisons innocent people all over the world indefinitely, without due process and without charging them with any crime.

We bear witness to the crimes of a rogue government that invades sovereign nations, bombs their cities into piles of rubble, murders with impunity, imposes harsh economic sanctions, denies women and children life saving medical treatment, and steals their oil and mineral wealth. Hypocritically, it calls those who resist occupation, terrorists.

I further contend that the government is engaged in a campaign of unlawfully monitoring the communications of its citizens, including the infiltration of Quaker religious orders that preach doctrines of peace over those of war, and is increasingly stifling free speech and the right of peaceful assembly. Our hard won civil liberties are giving way to an emerging police state. The prying eyes of paranoid government are everywhere.

Thus we are left with an illicit government that routinely commits crimes against humanity under the pretense of executing a war on terror. To its eternal shame, it has unleashed the National Security Agency, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Central Intelligence Agency, and the Pentagon upon its own citizens without just cause. These agencies are monitoring our computers, tapping our phones, and tracking our movements not to protect America from terrorists, but to protect the Plutocracy from those who would expose it.

What does it say about a government when those who uphold the Constitution and the rule of law are targeted as enemies of the state or as terrorists? Is this what Thomas Jefferson and the framers of the constitution intended?

The assassins of truth have the audacity to feign faith in god while daily committing unholy acts of terror against peace loving people at home and abroad. With the deftness of a public relations firm, they are using religion as a weapon against a guileless flock that blithely follows its every command, even as it leads them to the slaughter of an Armageddon of its own creation.

By these acts and worse, the U.S. government defines Democracy. It has been empowered to do so by Republicans and Democrats alike.

I hereby assert that the hidden purpose of the U.S. government is not to serve the needs of the people or to make the world free and democratic, as it so boldly claims; it is to accrue ever more wealth to the obscenely rich, the global elite. Its intent is to do to the U.S. what it has done to Iraq; to revoke the Constitution and the rule of law; to bankrupt the federal treasury and to privatize everything that is publicly owned. Ultimately its objective is to pursue the religion of unregulated free market capitalism, and to establish global corporate rule.

It seems to me that any government that does not serve the people and treats those who uphold the Constitution as terrorists is not a Democracy; and we should refrain from calling it by that name. Governmental power that is not derived from, and subservient to the people, is illegitimate—a form of authoritarian dictatorship as vile as Communism.

When an institution that was purportedly created to serve the needs of the people is no longer accountable to the people, and operates in secrecy, we can be sure that sinister powers are in motion. Those responsible are not only obscuring truth and revising history; they are knowingly and willfully assassinating truth, and mocking the very idea of Democracy.

Government that is controlled by capital, rather than a moral imperative to serve the public good, is a danger to the world. Such government is not only misguided and inherently unjust; it is hostile to Democracy and opposed to peace.

A government of the people would have a very different agenda than a Plutocratic regime. It would provide no cost health care to its citizens, free higher education to anyone who wants it; and it would not squander the federal treasury on unprovoked war that will not end in our lifetimes. Such a government would not overthrow democratically elected governments abroad. Nor would it throw its support behind terrorist states like Israel, and it would not finance brutal dictatorships like Saddam Hussein and Augusto Pinochet, as has been the history of the American government.

Democracies do not betray its citizens by outsourcing jobs to sweat shops in other parts of the world in order to maximize corporate profits and to drive down wages. They do not wage war on sovereign nations based upon lies and innuendo; they do not occupy other countries, and they do not plan additional wars and occupations at the behest of corporate lobbyists against nations that pose no threat to them.

Democracies do not sentence their youth to fight and die under false pretenses in order to open sovereign nations to corporate plunder and capitalism.

Plutocracy, I contend, is the outgrowth of the capitalist system that values private profits above all else. Under this sickly paradigm people are dehumanized; reduced to mere commodities on a par with a lump of coal or a pool of oil. It is a system that knows the price of everything but the value of nothing; and it is driven by insatiable greed.

Democracies derive their power from the people, all people being equal, and the distribution of wealth being equal. Plutocracies derive their power from the private ownership of immense wealth and property that represents a small percentage of the aggregate population. In the capitalist system, only those with wealth and property have legal standing and representation in government. All others are second class citizens with second class rights and subservient to the Plutocracy. It is about time that we learn the difference.

Charles Sullivan is a photographer, free lance writer and social activist residing in the hinterland of West Virginia.


video clip: How The Military Industrial Complex Makes Money Off 9/11(BBC Documentary)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCbzFJyVS-o

Reply #32 Top
I Understand the terrorist just fine, and there is no problem that a serious nuke will not fix, FAST!


Sounds like something Kim Jong il might say and as I understand it he seems to think the US is a terrorist state. So be careful what you ask for. And in the meantime try not to sound quite so much like someone routinely referred to as very disturbed madman.
Reply #33 Top

Sounds like something Kim Jong il might say

I would not compare anyone on this board to a spoiled 6 year old child, and that is all that Kim is.  He can call the moon his, but that does not make it so.

Reply #34 Top
You mentioned Christians and Muslims and atheists in your article while excluding the Jews... I presume you are a Jew yourself; with the name Gideon MacLeish, may be it was unintentional omission on your part, but certainly as a Jew myself I recognize the presence of Jewish extremists and fanatics amongst us, that have committed and are capable of many shameful acts.
I would like to point out that you do not reflect good judgment; when one is faced with an enemy you must understand everything about their background including their religion, what they believe in, what motivates them, why they do what they do. Enemies are not born, but made. You cannot stick your fingers in your ears and say “we do not need to understand them”, on the contrary we must make every effort to understand them in that respect. I personally encourage dialog between people of different faiths, we in general don't know much about Islam, when was the last time you bought a copy of a translated Quran and read it with explanations, it could be an eye opener for all of us!