The Register's take on Yahoo and Konfabulator

I say K'fab "Jumped the Shark" by agreeing to be bought by Yahoo. Should Stardock take the same approuch and let DX go to someone like Google? ...I hope Brad will be smarter, and just let DX be licenced from SD, and retain some degrees of control over it's future...

...only time will tell.

Wicked.

BTW, based on the widget I see in the k'fab gallery, I see no reason to install it, even if it's "free".

yeah .. well I think it is inevitable that someone makes a move on stardock .. probably Google .. as it's the best widget app out there - probably much more presence than konfabulator ... hope stardock retain some control though when it happens ... anyway , the yahoo version of konfabulator seems to have wrecked some of the good widgets for it .. and I bet apple are watching this too ... dashboard for windoes ... be willing to bet some $$ on it happening at some stage like itunes .. etc ..

I can say the same in DesktopX's gallery as well, WickedP.

As for Osopolar's comments, it's obvious he's easily confused by buzzword/buzzmoves.

Either Stardock has grudges against Konfabulator, or they're trying to be pointing fun at The Register.

Serious grudges against Konfabulator? Huh? Arlo Rose has been running around for the past two years claiming he's invented a totally new thing when places like The Register knew better. The Register's article is spot on. What the heck was Yahoo thinking? They could have bought a freeware widget program. Why didn't they? Yahoo probably bought into Arlo Rose's hype.

It would be interesting to see if Avedesk get bought out by Google...

I'll admit that Konfab has some great widgets. I just saw a widget for my Mom to use (Mega Millions Lotto) and I am going to install Konfabulator on my sisters computer (of which also my Mom uses).

I know DX can do it, but I currently do not have the knowledge to make some of the things I want, plus I have not finished some of my schooling on VB, VB.NET, and Javascript.

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I think this whole thing will end up being a short winfall for Yahoo, but eventually go the way of Sonque (spell?) and in some ways like WinAmp. I think Yahoo's main goal here is to get people interested into Yahoo's API's as people are interested in Googles (for example the 'mash-up between Google Maps and Craigslist).

I think THAT is the big news for Yahoo, not the survival of Konfabulator in the future; they want the widget developers! If they get more out of it, like Yahoo's Flikr photo images, Yahoo 360 blogging or My Yahoo homepage development, the better. Imagine being able to tag searches (using Flikr's tagging ability), then blogging about it, then sending it to friends and family on a personal widget.


But I digress; the main reason for this purchase is to get at those freelance developers and coding enthusists, not Konfabulator. (Keep in mind that Mac people also have the graphic artists, can be more loyal, and spend more money per person tha PC users, so now Yahoo has moved in on PC and Mac in one stroke)

'Sonique' ...

Hope WinCustomize & DX keep doing what their doing & Yahoo/Konfab keeps on doing what their doing - I'll stick with DX thank you very much!! ROCK-ON BRAD!!!

Thanks!

Also note:
Yahoo owns or operates Flikr (a photo sharing site), Yahoo 360 (of which is a blogging service), My Yahoo personal webpages, MusicMatch JukeBox (a music player), so by getting Konfabulator, they can make the coolest widgets in the world! From music playing to videos from the latest superstar to showing off your pictures to family to blogging to searching to tagging (the reason why, some speculate, that Yahoo purchased Flikr is because of the technology behind users 'tagging' items to make it easier to search). Can you imaging super widgets that connect directly to these apps or even become mini-apps of these web based services?

Maybe even a search app like Google but skinnable?


I still think Yahoo did this mainly to get people interested in its API's. It wanted lead users and developers to play around with its products and services as well as its API's so that it can somehow challenge Google's free geek developer manpower (IE Google Maps - Craistlist's Housing).


Konfabulator can crash and burn, but Yahoo gets those lead users.

It's only a matter of time now before the beginning of the influx of 'ported from a Konfab widget by blah blah' DX widgets begins........

I've been a long-time user of Object Desktop (I even have an OS/2 version...) and have watched the development of that package and DesktopX with great interest. However, I'm interested in seeing what Yahoo does with Konfabulator. Looking at recent history, pay-for-play applications have suffered when their capabilities are incorporated into an operating system or a "free" alternative comes along.

Netscape Navigator vs. Internet Explorer (Windows 95)
Kaleidoscope vs. Appearance Control Panel (Mac OS 9)
Internet Explorer vs. Firefox
Konfabulator vs. Widgits (Mac OS 10.4 - Tiger)

I think the handwriting was on the wall for Konfabulator unless they did something as radical as being swallowed by a bigger fish. Now they have a chance to get a bigger distribution push. And by being cross-platform (PC & Mac)- they have the opportunity to grab users in both camps. That's gonna make it tough on everyone else - how do you compete with someone who is multi-platform and giving the stuff away?

Yeah, they could end up like Sonique - in eternal development hell. Or like Winamp - with the developers jumping ship since being aquired by AOL. Only time will tell...

how do you compete with someone who is multi-platform and giving the stuff away?

You make a better proggy....easy-peasy....

When you go multiplatform you lose a lot of features.  That's why we've never entertained supporting Mac (or Linux) with DesktopX. 

I can say the same in DesktopX's gallery as well, WickedP. As for Osopolar's comments, it's obvious he's easily confused by buzzword/buzzmoves. Either Stardock has grudges against Konfabulator, or they're trying to be pointing fun at The Register.

BTW, Xira, I read your post over on Konfabulator.com.  I was going to respond there but they have a tendancy to remove posts they don't like.  

I have nothing against Konfabulator.  I was using it long before you I suspect.  I was one of the people strongly defending Konfabulator's innovation during the Dashboard incident. 

But the problem with Konfabulator is that Arlo Rose, like the Register article points out, likes to take credit for things that have nothing to do with him. 

For example: http://www.konfabulator.com/cartoon/partFour.html

"It was the coolest thing anyone who had ever used it had ever seen on their desktops.."

By the time Konfabulator came out, DesktopX was 3 years old.  And while I'm as keen on weather monitors, stock tickers, web cams and clocks as the next guy, I suspect anyone who had ever used DesktopX, let alone Object Desktop, had seen a lot cooler stuff than Konfabulator.

Konfabulator has been out 2 years now and still doesn't have any native animation support.  DesktopX in 2000 still has more features than Konfabulator does today.  I'm not arguing that DesktopX is "better" than Konfabulator.  But I think it was pretty tacky for Arlo to make the bold claim how cool and original Konfabulator was at release.   He seems to have that typical Mac attitude that if it doesn't exist on the Mac, it doesn't exist at all.

According to Arlo's own page: http://www.konfabulator.com/cartoon/partOne.html  We even had the IDEA for mini-applets on the desktop.  The idea for DesktopX was born in February of 1996 shortly after seeing IBM's OpenDoc based desktop.  We thought "Cool, if people could build their own desktops with real objects, they could add all kinds of functionality to it."  By the time Arlo was even thinking of Konfabulator we were already in pre-production.

Then in http://www.konfabulator.com/cartoon/partTwo.html he talks about how no one was interested in creating something like this between 1999 and 2001.  By this point, DesktopX had been released and been downloaded over a million times just on CNET's Download.com alone and had been featured in countless magazines.

Arlo deserves credit for two things in my book: 1) He coined the term "widget" to describe these mini-applications.  We were using the term "object" which was apparently too generic.  And 2) He demonstrated the importance of including really REALLY slick examples with the default install.  And there's actually a third, more dubious item he deserves credit: 3) If you claim something loudly enough, often enough, people in the media will believe it.

As for Konfabulator being bought by Yahoo.  I think it's a mixed thing.  On the one hand, it may get widgets out there a lot more.  But on the other hand, I doubt Yahoo will be anywhere nearly as effective at marketing it as Arlo has been.  And I still believe that gadgets are a much better platform than widgets.  

So you could say I'm a fan of the program but not as big of a fan of the way they've marketed it. Next time someone complains about Stardock being overly aggressive or whatever in how it "markets" its software, send them over to those Konfabulator cartoon pages or read some of their press releases. 

I actually think overall the variety in Konfabulator widgets is greater than DX. Although I agree DX is going in the better direction via gadgets. I just hope gadget creaters get more variety in their releases.

The power in these tools, no matter their name, is to gain functionality without bloatware. For users to be able to pick and choose tiny pieces of functionality that THEY need greatly increases productivity and usability, particularly for power users.

Yahoo! has a history of taking good, marketable ideas and buying them, only to allow them to get lost in the mix. Yahoo! owns a ton of useful applications, but take a look two clicks deep into their site and let me know what they are.

Yahoo! deserves Konfabulator, and vice versa. The target audience for widgets and gadgets isn't my mom, it's me, she would never take the time to find, learn about and use widgets. I, on the other hand, would, but the caveat is that I would also go the extra step and find out which one genuinely meets needs better. Then I would make a decision on the best product that met my needs, not the most marketed one.

Just my $0.02, DesktopX wins again.

I did point out in this very forum that these guys were getting all the PR/press and were going to be eating Stardock's lunch because of it. The best PR firms do exactly what Arlo did for their clients. Congrats to them.

But now, Arlo doesn't need to do anything, because Yahoo is a huge machine, and all they have to do to market their product immediately to millions of people is put a link/ad/graphic on their home page and self-plant on-line and magazine articles and reviews that point to it. Regardless of the history or the truth, Mom and Pop computer user will finally hear of "the revolutionary desktop widget concept that Yahoo invented and brought to the masses."

The best news for Stardock (and I love your products guys) is that this may finally force Google's and/or Microsoft's hand with regards to Stardock. I can hear the wheels turning now.

Being acquired by Yahoo! is huge, don't doubt that. While DesktopX is very cool and powerful, it is not cross platform. That is a major drawback for someone like Yahoo or Google since they serve the masses and not just one platform. As do many other hosted model type businesses. They want cross-platform support.

The positive side of DesktopX stuff is that they can be compiled and distributed in stand-alone packages. That's about the only big plus I see at the momemnt, especially given the unstableness of DesktopX that I have seen.

In any case - it should really push the guys at Stardock to kick it up a notch and make their development enviornment easier to use and more features etc... if they want to keep charging for it.

Hum, sorry, but Yahoo! doesn't seem tha interested in cross-plateform either. Past aquisitions weren't cross-plateform and they haven't updated Yahoo Chat for Mac in two years. I all fairness Yahoo! seems to actually be losing interest into the Mac plateform.
And Limbo, you're talking about the development environment of Desktop X as compared to the development environment of what other application? As far as I know, other widgets programs do NOT have an authoring environement. Just hand scripting in Notepad please... Of course Notepad is stable, but ease of use? Features?? Please... Desktop X is miles ahead.

Downloaded Konfabulator from Major geeks last night to see what all the fuss was about....nothing much to write home about tho.
DesktopX beats it hands down for versatility and practical ability.
Furthermore, the widgets available on the home page are limited in that most apply only to US cities and etc, which offers little to O/S users in countries like australia, etc.
And before somebody says: " Well you could always make your own." not everyone is versatile or experienced enough to script and enable a widget.

Furthermore, If Yahoo bought Konfabulator with good intentions for it, then why have they made it so difficult to find on their site? Since this item came up here on WC, I have returned several times to Yahoo and still haven't found it there. Perhaps the true objective was to acquire the programmers and script writers rather than the program after all

They only bought it a few days ago, I suspect it'll take a bit for Yahoo-designed widgets to be made.

Nice 3-4 posts of constant FUD.

Not only has Yahoo! acquired Konfabulator, they've highered Arlo and the rest of the team to continue to develop it.

"Not only has Yahoo! acquired Konfabulator, they've highered Arlo and the rest of the team to continue to develop it.".... suggesting the intended acquisition was the development.


Sorry Jafo hired was your job

I'm using it now for the weather widget, which I prefer to all the DesktopX and Kapsules weather widgets I've tried.

I think the Sun widget is SUPER cool, but unfortunately it interferes with my start menu being erased (or at least start menus with transparency). I'd love to see something like that done in DesktopX.

Hum, sorry, but Yahoo! doesn't seem that interested in cross-plateorm either. Past acquisitions weren't cross-platform and they haven't updated Yahoo Chat for Mac in two years. I all fairness Yahoo! seems to actually be losing interest into the Mac platform.

Yup, they are SMART businessmen indeed. Note that the ONLY people who care about "cross-platform" anymore are Mac people and the shareware OS Linux uses. Since Apple has a built in widget feature with the OS and Linux is still driven by 70's unix/vax/command line hobbyist/programmers, the market for GUI dependant products like Yahoo/Konfabulator and Stardock/Desktop X remains with the 95% of the rest of the world.

Which is why I pointed out that Google and Microsoft are both very likely to make overtures to Stardock right now. Microsoft makes the most sense since they have pockets deep enough to interest Brad and his crew and they could add a HUGE list of eye candy/functionality features to Longhorn by acquiring/partnering with Stardock. Stardock, of course, gets resources up the whazoo, and a presence on every desktop across the world. And since there really is no major competition in this market, and what competition there is has become owned by competitors (Apple and Yahoo), there shouldn't be any anti-trust issues here at all. So, my guess it that this would be an easy coup for both parties.

Stay near your phone, Brad.

I had never heard of Konfabulator until I saw the article here... I went to yahoo (sigh, where I do, in fact, have an account) (well, I have them all over...). I did a search on yahoo and instantly came up with the information and links to the software and widgets.
Being the download junkie that I am, after seeing a few of the Konfabulator widgets, I started downloading.

I've used Stardock apps for a long time, and am slowly learning how to do the more "techie" stuff (when I have time between classes and research), and have long been appreciative of the ways I can change the look of my desktop.

I am currently running DesktopX widgets with Konfabulator widgets. There are some pretty neat widgets over there that I wish were here - for now, I can use both. Hmmmmmm. Both. What a concept.

Suzanne