What IS Child Abuse?

http://daingean.blogspot.com/
from JoeUser Forums
 

WHAT IS CHILD ABUSE ?

 

Father Hughes and his "testimony" at the Commission to Inquire in Child Abuse

Father Hughes refused to describe beatings on the bare buttocks with a strap as 'abuse'

Father Hughes stated the sexual abuse allegations were "totally and completely denied" by the Oblates.

Father Hughes said the Oblate Order was "surprised" at the numerous complaints of physical abuse received by the commission.

Father Hughes said the Oblates denied there was "shameful neglect" of the boys' education and that they were being made use of as labourers.

Father Hughes said the Oblates denied the boys were "dirty and unkempt" and that the showers at Daingean were "rusted and disintegrating" through lack of use, or that toilets were "dirty and unsanitary"

Father Hughes said The Oblates admitted that strapping of the bare buttocks of boys had occurred.

Father Hughes said that the strapping of the bare buttocks of boys was carried out "in good faith"

Father Hughes said that people at the time "didn't think strapping boys on the bare buttocks was abuse".

Father Hughes conceded that the punishment could be "very, very severe",

Father Hughes said he would be "doing an injustice to the men of that time to say it was abuse".

Father Hughes said that men under such stress "might snap and become abusive"

Father Hughes was aware of concerns of members of the Kennedy committee, which inspected Daingean in 1968, at the administration of corporal punishment to the boys over the bare buttocks and that the then resident manager there, Fr McGonagle, appeared to accept the value of such punishment as "more humiliating". Fr McGonagle, he said, denied saying he accepted the added value of such humiliation, though he had not denied the boys so punished were naked or had their shirts pulled up.

No punishment books - required by law - had survived from Daingean. He didn't know what happened to them.

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4,031 views 16 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Here is an article that tries to claim that child abuse is something that only men can inflict upon children. It would help if, for a change, some reality were injected into the picture, but that might upset a few feminists, and that we just can't have, can we?

In the overwhelming majority of cases of child abuse, it is the mother or female caregiver who abuses the child, yet this article would have us believe that the abuser is some sadistic male who gets his jollies by strapping a child's bare bottom with a belt or some such object of torture. It does not matter that facts have proven that most abusers are female. Facts are totally unimportant when men can be maligned in print.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
QUOTE "Here is an article that tries to claim that child abuse is something that only men can inflict upon children.UNQUOTE
The Article does not claim THAT. And you obviously did not follow the link.
QUOTE "yet this article would have us believe that the abuser is some sadistic male who gets his jollies by strapping a child's bare bottom with a belt or some such object of torture" UNQUOTE

And its irrelevant to claim that to tell the truth of child abuse in Irish Child Dentention Institutions would upset feminist .... that's nonsense.

Follow the links ... they tell the stories of abuse by Catholic religious orders (nuns and male clergy) against children.

http://www.ultimatedisposal.org/index2.html

http://theknitter.joeuser.com/index.asp?AID=61386
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Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
In any society or culture that is male-dominated, e.g., Catholic Ireland (like all organised religions) women, that is, mothers, tend to REACT violently, and therefore tend to become psychologically more male (macho) than their male Masters. Irish-Catholic mothers have, in the main, become "masculinised". So have American women. That's why Irish (and American) mothers, in general are so non-maternal, i.e., unable to nurture (love) their children in a natural way. At the end of day, its all to do with the notion of the "Christian" West - which is no longer part of mainstream Western Europe... its all about growing-up the hard way, i.e., which is what ALL motherless children have to struggle with.....
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
What I find annoying is that governments don't bother to establish what abuse is, and for centuries spanking children with a belt or strap, bare bottom or not, was considered legitimate punishment.

If your grandfather was spanked with a belt, and your father was spanked with a belt, and you were spanked with a belt, then you might be surprised when you are hauled before a court and called an abuser for doing it. I would like to know if any attempt had been made to assimilate these people to the idea that such was abuse before they were criminalized for it.

That's not to say that spanking kids with a belt is right or wrong. I am simply saying that you can't take something that is commonplace and criminalize it in a single generation without creating 'scapegoats' for society as a whole.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
I was spanked with a hanger. I was never abused. However, if a member of my clergy ever spanked me with a hanger he would have been abused by my dad!! ;~D
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top
Hi celtic pist - thanks for the "histrionic" lesson. Perhaps I should send a link to your mother-confessor Florance so she can get your tablets ... or perhaps not!
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
Reply to BakerStreet:

The systematic corporal punishment of children is ALWAYS wrong - in any generation. Very little changes in a single generation that is for the common good. The only systems (societies or individuals) that have a need for scapegoats are those who refuse to look at their own failings.
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
Reply to ParaTed:

Your Dad sounds like your typical schizoid child-abuser. Its OK for him to hit his kids, for not for others? Hitting kids is wrong, full stop!

Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
Reply to Not-so-anonymous-Andrew-The-Knitter-Brennan:

Pist or miffed yourself Andrew? Whose Florance anyway? Tell me more??? Tablets? Don't do drugs of any kind. No need to, as I'm an expert knitter myself. Its great therapy!!!

Take it easy - too much knitting is bad for you!
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
Hitting (spanking) kids is wrong, full stop


This is the kind of ignorant thinking that put us in the mess we are today! Because our children know that if they mess up bad, there's not a whole lot we as parents can do about it. Please do not try you psycho-babble on me. It won't do anything but get me angry. And you won't like me when I'm angry!
Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top
Celtic Mist. And you sound like a typical idiot who makes a total fool of themselves speaking out about that which you know nothing about. You are part of the problem Celtic Mist. People like you blurr the line between legitimate discipline and abuse, enabling the abuser and their lawyers. Because of that blurring innocent people get punished and real abusers get off. If you think the world stinks, better check the foul stench from your own words before pointing your finger at others.
Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
"The systematic corporal punishment of children is ALWAYS wrong - in any generation. Very little changes in a single generation that is for the common good. The only systems (societies or individuals) that have a need for scapegoats are those who refuse to look at their own failings."


Even if society agrees with you, hindsight is 20/20. You can make all the universal truths up you like, but it doesn't change the fact that such behavior was accepted and commonplace. When you abruptly take something from commonplace to criminal, people will have to be made scapegoats to push the point.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
The fact is, the abuse and violation of children is all too normalised in our so-called civilised society. And the problem with the normalisation of abuse and violence is that the majority of people end up not knowing the difference between right and wrong - which is why we end up with corrupt governments who can (and do) use and abuse us (as adults) with impunity... and we keep on returning them to power!!!

The bottom line is, if you haven't learned what love and self-respect is as a child (by being loved and respected) you'll have little chance of finding out what it is as an adult!

Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
You come at "normalization" from the wrong end. No one ever "normalized" the behavior listed in this article. It has been "normal" for tens of thousands of years.

What you are talking about is normalizing non-abuse, and that is never given more than lip service. The idea that this is so self-apparent that anyone would say "duh" is self-defeating when the behavior is almost universal. At the time these abuses occured, they simply weren't abuses in the definition of the time.

The crux of the problem is a sector of the population suddenly considering something "normal", and not bothering to normalize the rest of the population. Worse, demands were made upon these people as to the behavior of the children they cared for, and no tools are offered them to replace the abuses.

Celtic Mist's attitude CAUSES more abuse than it helps. It's like suddenly telling a carpenter that it is wrong to use a hammer, and skipping away without giving them anything else to use. There was no "normalization" involved, not to make abuse acceptable, NOR to acclimate the population to different tactics.
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
The fact is, the abuse and violation of children is all too normalised in our so-called civilised society. And the problem with the normalisation of abuse and violence is that the majority of people end up not knowing the difference between right and wrong - which is why we end up with corrupt governments who can (and do) use and abuse us (as adults) with impunity... and we keep on returning them to power!!!

The bottom line is, if you haven't learned what love and self-respect is as a child (by being loved and respected) you'll have little chance of finding out what it is as an adult!


I'm sorry but this is a load of horse-puckey! By your standards the spankings with a belt I got as a kid were abuse. And because of that I could not tell the difference between right and wrong?
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
I think they really need this to be something because of other wrongs that occured. I'm not disputing those, only the subject of this article.