How far can you go?

from JoeUser Forums

How much can one person change before they lose sight of themselves completely?

I've changed, and I've changed for the wrong damn reasons.  Some of the change has been for me....but most of it has been for someone else, because it's been easier to change than it has been to live with that person without changing (read that twice and it will make sense, trust me).

When he's here, I can't be myself.  Not totally.  It pisses him off.  I piss him off. It's just easier to live with him and pretend to be someone else than it is to be myself and deal with his wrath/whining/unhappiness.  See, he's pretty vocal and has a lot of endurance.  That can be a drag.  A real drag.

So, I hide myself in a shell that outwardly looks like me, but acts the way he wants me to.  I imagine he does the same thing sometimes. 

But anyway, back to my original question.....how much can a person change and still retain the essence of who they are?  I mean, we all change in some ways; sometimes we may even be unrecognisable as our 'old' selves...but I still think that the essence, the spirit of who 'we' really are remains.

I'm losing myself.  I dont like it.  See, it took me until I was in my late twenties to really learn to like myself and what I was about, and I don't want to give that up.  I really don't want to give 'me' up.  I don't want to change anymore, I'll lose myself if I do and become a total fabrication.  A walking shell....the lights are on but nobody's in. 'Me' won't be in there, it'll just be empty.

All this complaning makes me sound like I don't love him.  That's not the case.  Of course I do.  I always will.  But.....

...I don't want to pretend to be someone I'm not, and I don't think that who I am now can make him happy.  Not for the rest of his life, anyway.  And, I don't think that I can pretend to be someone I'm not for the rest of my life either.

I can't not be ME, dig?

 

 

 

 

misc
6,516 views 23 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
It's really not giving anything up at all. You make it sound like you're in love with what used to be, rather than being in love with where you are now, today. This essence you mentioned...in a perfect world that would be true but being (somewhat normal) humans we have that pesky mental reflex where we trick ourselves into thinking about ourselves in a better light. Something may happen and instead of saying 'yes that's a problem' we tend to say 'that's how I feel anyways' as if our true essence has remained constant. I think the truth is that whatever we perceive our true essence to be, it's as moldable as silly putty and/or play-doh. Even the act of questioning what our true essence is shows it's completely changeable on a day to day basis though more so on a year to year basis. We would never question our true essence if it's the same as it was last week or last year or when you were in high school. The act of doing so would be so useless as to be totally futile. It's like asking whether we think we're going to stop at the next red light we see. When it's constant, there is no questioning it, ever.
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
As much as you can fabricate the outter layer, your true self will always shine through. I totally understand what you mean.

When Hardin and I first got together I was a rebellious, loudmouthed chick with a streak of mischief. I wasn't the best behaived in the bunch. I had every color of hair in the rainbow. I used to do drugs and didn't take shit from anybody.

At first, I think at times he was somewhat ashamed (although he would never admit it) of my behavior and old habits that I changed a bit. I quieted down and became shy because I thought he was embarrassed.

At this point in my life I am working on finding a happy medium of the two. I no longer need to do stupid things to define myself. Actually, Hardin and I somewhat change together. Unlike then, we always discuss everything. Sometimes it leads to fighting, but hey, I guess it's better to have your point across then to pretend you're something you're not.

D should let you be you.

Does this make any sense?
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Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top

You make it sound like you're in love with what used to be, rather than being in love with where you are now, today.

No, I'm in love with what I am today.  I've always been this way, it's just come to the fore recently.  I've kind of had the opportunity and the reason to live according to my philosophy for the past year and a half....I, ME, came to the front, and I liked it.  When he was back, I had to.....hide myself.  Cover ME up, because he didn't like it.  He's not interested in Buddhism.  He's not interested in philosophy.  He's not interested in what I want to do, he's interested in what he wants to do, and ME has to fit in with that or the consequences aren't pretty.

Hardin and I somewhat change together.

We used to as well.  I wish that we still could.  I hope that we still can.

More than anything, I want him to want me for ME.  I want him to be happy with ME.

Yes, it made perfect sense.

Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
You can never dip your foot in the same river twice.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top

You can never dip your foot in the same river twice.

That's very profound, Baker.  That's koan material right there...

Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
Smooth, crystal clear writing. Insightful on that merit alone...


Why thank you, kind sir! You should go check out my latest......Link
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top

A cry in the absence.  You already changed.  You are just going through stage 2.  You have some freedom, and are enjoying it now that the goodbye is gone.  Next comes the missing. 

My wife and I have different schedules and so maybe once or twice a year, we are in different cities.  At first, it is fine!  I dont have to worry about wiping feet and schedules.  That passes after a couple of days and then I feel a great emptiness.  Which is not filled until she returns.

is that me being me? Perhaps.  But then I know I am not whole until I am with her again.  Marriage is a compromise.  We have to give, and we get.  When our other half is gone, we dont have to give.  But then when we get over not giving, we realize we are not getting either.

Just my 2 cents.

Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
You can never dip your foot in the same river twice.


(Looks at Bakerstreet, dips his foot in the Colorado..............dips it again........huh.....Wanders off clapping one hand at himself and is struck dead unaware, by a tree when it falls in the woods without making a sound...........) Sorry, just a koany joke............

I counsel patience. Not necessarily compromise, but patience. Relationships take love, commitment, and work. Which I know you know, you know? One of the hardest things for me is patience, but I've found out the hard way, that when I make a major decision, or even just take a look at my life and my relationship, I make better decisions when I look it over again after a few days, or even a few weeks, while working on it a little every day.

It's when I rush that I say stupid, hurtful things, that I get depressed, that I end up in the Army for 5 to 8 years...........
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top

You have some freedom, and are enjoying it now that the goodbye is gone. Next comes the missing.

But I do miss him, and I am lonely.  I'm at that stage already.....

I can't be anyone but me, and that doesn't make him happy.  So, I have to either a) spend the rest of my life being myself with him and getting bitched at, or b) be someone else and have him not bitch or c) well....c is something that I still have a lot of contemplating to do over and I'm not ready to talk about yet.

Which I know you know, you know? One of the hardest things for me is patience, but I've found out the hard way, that when I make a major decision, or even just take a look at my life and my relationship, I make better decisions when I look it over again after a few days, or even a few weeks, while working on it a little every day.

Thanks for giving me some credit....and yes, I do know.

I'm giving it some time...after all, that's all I really have to give.

 

Reply #11 from JoeUser Forums Top

Thanks for giving me some credit....and yes, I do know.
I'm giving it some time...after all, that's all I really have to give.

I read the other one as well.  Make us a deal.  Sleep on it and then answer these questions.

you do not have to, but I challenge you to.

Respond in the morning.  You are just one hour off from out time.  We can wait.

Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
you do not have to, but I challenge you to.


I accept your challenge, and tomorrow morning, once I've had some coffee and I'm awake, I'll respond.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
I accept your challenge, and tomorrow morning, once I've had some coffee and I'm awake, I'll respond.


Peace and a great night of sleep. We are your cyber family and we do understand, if not exactly.

Sweetest of dreams and the peacefullness of nights.
Reply #14 from JoeUser Forums Top
dharma: Honest opinion? Deployments fuck up relationships...simply by their very design. And you guys keep going from together for a bit then away for a long bit...of course you're going to struggling with this shit...and it will keep coming up again and again so long as you guys are going through the deployment and reunion cycle.

I don't guess that was in any way constructive, sorry...but...I do wish you the best.
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top

I don't guess that was in any way constructive, sorry...but...I do wish you the best.

Nah, Chickie......it was helpful.  You know what I'm going through, just because you've been there. *wink* you know what I mean.

We are your cyber family and we do understand, if not exactly.

I know that you are, and I thank you for that.....but I don't think that you totally understand my dilemma.

Time will tell, I guess.

Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
Perhaps it isn't so much a question of "being someone different" as it is in learning to express who you are in a different manner.

Interacting with others requires us to choose and moderate how we express ourselves. It doesn't mean we have to be someone different, just perhaps find a way to express who we are in a way that isn't perceived in a negative light by others.

The only difference between the artist selling paintings in a gallery and the one painting on the sides of private buildings is the manner in which they express their artistic personality. One is viewed as acceptable, and one isn't.

Now if it's a matter of changing one's views or thoughts, that's another kettle of fish. You can't be expected to do this by any reasonable person, but again expression must be considered.

Does this make any sense? Or is it way off target?
Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top

Now if it's a matter of changing one's views or thoughts, that's another kettle of fish. You can't be expected to do this by any reasonable person, but again expression must be considered.

Yes, this made sense.  All of y'all have made sense in one way or another.

I am expected to change my thoughts, not my expressions.  At least, that's the way it seems and feels.  As long as what I'm doing is 'officially sanctioned' I'm good.  But, if it's not........well, then I'm going to hear about it.  On a daily basis.  For weeks.  Sometimes for months. 

I'm so fucking torn it's unreal. 

The rest I'll leave for tomorrow.

Reply #18 from JoeUser Forums Top
As long as what I'm doing is 'officially sanctioned' I'm good. But if it's not........well, then I'm going to hear about it.


Big, big-time ouch. Been there, done that...both the giving and recieving ends. It passed.....mostly, but still, ouch.
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
How much can one person change before they lose sight of themselves completely?


This is probably the most important question a thinking person can ask themselves, in my books. The answer I would tender is we can change as much as we desire and so long as we have an awareness of these changes, we will never lose sight of ourselves.

it's been easier to change than it has been to live with that person without changing


I think a lot of us have been in this position before. In my latest post, I make a point about when we're young, we do things thinking it will make us happy but, in a lot of cases, it actually does the opposite. Going against one true self is always damaging. I think true change should occur naturally, kinda like the seasons change. It happens so subtly, we're hardly even aware of it until one day, we wake up and its Spring.

I really don't think you are losing yourself. I think in a lot of ways, you're probably becoming the real self you want to be.

it took me until I was in my late twenties to really learn to like myself and what I was about


Like you, I didn't really start getting to know who I was until my late twenties. Up until then, I think I was trying to be something I thought others wanted me to be. I wouldn't have changed for the world, but then events conspired to show me I was wrong. So I changed, for the better, I believe.

Maybe you should try to think of yourself as the 'uncarved block' or the Pu, if you like. There is nothing like having an empty canvas in front of you and a great array of colours to fill it up with. I think you are full of the colours you want to be, you just need to get painting.

I hope this made some sense to you.
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top

Big, big-time ouch. Been there, done that...both the giving and recieving ends. It passed.....mostly, but still, ouch.

Yeah.  That's been life in my shoes for a while now.

I really don't think you are losing yourself. I think in a lot of ways, you're probably becoming the real self you want to be.

Maso, I swear to fucking god you're living in my head.

 

think I was trying to be something I thought others wanted me to be.

Me too.  I don't want to do that any more.

There is nothing like having an empty canvas in front of you and a great array of colours to fill it up with. I think you are full of the colours you want to be, you just need to get painting.

I think I'm picking up my brush, mate. And the colors are.......wonderful.

Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
Don't I know it. So get to painting. I can hardly wait to see what you come up with...
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
Just another thought

lack of change = stagnation = death

change is the true nature of the universe
Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top
"When he was back, I had to.....hide myself. Cover ME up, because he didn't like it. He's not interested in Buddhism. He's not interested in philosophy."
You mean your husband leaves for war or whatever and he comes back and you're all into Buddhism and philosophy, when you weren't when he left? If so, he must have has a marriage-type of culture shock. I'd be like "what? what the hell do you mean you're a buddhist now?". A guy likes to return to what he left, not what someone may consider 'new and improved'. Hang in there and make him see the light.