Are You Obese?

Ya wanna be sterile?

Link

Alright, so here's the thing: Obesity isn't good. I think that's a fairly straightforward statement that nearly everyone would agree with. Bad for the heart, bad for the body, bad for a person in general. High blood pressure, clogged arteries, trouble breathing, etc. Fine. But:

In California, there is a program in place where obese men can have state-funded vasectomies to ensure that their inferior genetic material will not live on in the next generation. Again I say fine, albeit less enthusiastically, because I really don't like the thought of legislation picking and choosing genetic defects to eliminate; Albinos are also the victims of a genetic defect, as are dwarfs, as are people with sickle cell anemia, Tay-sachs, etc. While I am aware that there is no sterility measure necessary for sickle cell and tay-sachs since those diseases usually kill the victims early in life, and that albinism and dwarfism do not pose the potential health risks of obesity, it is also true that obese people have the ability to live normal lives, not to mention lose weight and have healthy children. There is no doubt that if one is genetically inclined towards obesity, it is up to that person to know about it and handle the situation in a way that they see fit, but I equate this with the child of an alcoholic being more likely to become addicted. It is not something that has to be eliminated, just controlled, and not by a government, but by an individual.

As I mentioned earlier, though, I am still okay with the state offering free vasectomies to obese men. As the article I link to mentions, the procedure is voluntary. The men enter into it of their own free will. However, I find something truly disturbing about the last sentence in the fifth paragraph:

"If we are to make this procedure mandatory, we must clearly draw the lines where physician judgment is concerned."

If??? Why is this even being considered? If we decide to forceably sterilize obese people? As long as the physician attests that it is for the benefit of future generations? According to recent polls, more than half of the NFL is obese. Using the same criteria, Shaquille O'neal was identified as obese.

There is, I believe, an alarming misconception that people who tip the scales cannot be active, or athletic, or happy. I'm not trying to refute the overwhelming medical evidence, because I agree that obesity poses a health risk. However, when we start talking about the possibility of forcible sterilization to control a defective gene, which, by the way, can be controlled, be it with an exercise plan, surgery, etc., we are taking the concept of "protecting society from itself" way, way, WAY too far.

Personal responsibility is still alive somewhere, probably cold, hungry, and injured. Hopefully, we can find it before it's too late.
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Reply #1 Top
"However, when we start talking about the possibility of forcible sterilization to control a defective gene, which, by the way, can be controlled, be it with an exercise plan, surgery, etc., we are taking the concept of "protecting society from itself" way, way, WAY too far."

This would most definately be going way, way too far. If they do this then they might as well start doing it to any and everyone who do not measure up to the ideal of the "it" generation!

"I believe, an alarming misconception that people who tip the scales cannot be active, or athletic, or happy. I'm not trying to refute the overwhelming medical evidence, because I agree that obesity poses a health risk."

I agree with you and it's definately not saying there's no health risk for people who are obese but there are people who are heavy and very active.
Reply #2 Top
If they do this then they might as well start doing it to any and everyone who do not measure up to the ideal of the "it" generation!


While I did think of the possibility of this to degenerate into complete genetic engineering to fit a preset sociall acceptable model of a human being, I did not mention it in my article because I believe the proposition has a built in defense: It can point to the obesity gene threatening the well-being of our future, which can't really be done with the other genetic anomalies that I mentioned.

Nevertheless, there is always a danger of politicians, or politically motivated doctors, to abuse a measure such as this for their own personal gains, and so I feel this line of thought is still valid in this case.
Reply #3 Top
Personal responsibility is still alive somewhere, probably cold, hungry, and injured. Hopefully, we can find it before it's too late.


Personal responsibility? No it's your fault that I am the way that I am! ..
Reply #4 Top
There are two insidous concepts at work here. Bigotry and Money.

Just another example of how it's ok to hate some people, and still be able to lie about being "open minded".

There was a dark time in our history that we sterilized "undesireables"; well it looks like the bigots of the country are at it again. This time instead of openly admitting to hatred, they are masking it with "medical" or "genetic" pathetic excuses.

The money aspect began when we started expecting others to pay the bills for our medical treatment. We have established a reality where ALL our healthcare is paid for by someone else. Insurance is expected to pay for everything. Not only don't we pay for our healthcare, but we turn to our employers to pay for the coverage. So much so, that most arguments I hear or read about the topic equate healthcare coverage with healthcare itself.

The only reason anyone would accept government control of any healthcare is that we have already started insisting they take care of us in other aspects of our care. "I'm too weak, frail and pathetic to do it on my own."

So, now, in the name of cleaning the gene pool, we have come full circle. Except, of course, when it was discovered that the government was sterilizing Black men agaisnt their will before, it was stopped. Now it is all but welcomed.
Reply #5 Top
If this happens where do we stop? People with bad teeth? bad eyesight? bad lungs? to tall? to short? anorexic? bulimic? sighhhhhhhhh death is starting to look better and better all the time.


elie
Reply #6 Top
Wow. This is just... stupid. And depressing. Sure, obesity is bad, but not nearly bad enough to treat the obese as some sort of defect on society.
Reply #7 Top
There was a dark time in our history that we sterilized "undesireables"; well it looks like the bigots of the country are at it again. This time instead of openly admitting to hatred, they are masking it with "medical" or "genetic" pathetic excuses.


True. I decided to give the article the benefit of the doubt and not raise the genetic engineering point, but the thought did cross my mind.

Reply #8 Top
Remember that movie with Ethan Hawke and Uma Thurman..can't think of the name? Was it Gothica? Anyway, it was about genetics and who is the perfect human, being up there in the perfect world, having all the cool stuff, job, etc. I would hate to see our society become like that. Warped, really warped! But you give these people an inch, and allow them to take liberties, where will they stop and when will it end? Nobody knows...
Reply #9 Top

I didn't know that Hitler was alive and living in California.......

I also was not aware that they have proved genetics to be the problem.....couldn't it just be that we eat too much and don't get enough physical activity?  Wait...it can't be the individuals fault...I forgot....

I blame my weight on nobody but myself.  I have an autoimmune disease and no longer have a thyroid, yet I know it is what I feed myself and my love of my couch that causes my weight problem.  I guess I must be unique   

Reply #10 Top
Dr. Mengele would be proud of the Caliphoneyans. They don't want real people, they want freaks who can fit in with all the rest of the 'thin is good' BS that is spreading like peanut butter over rye. Maybe there should be mandatory health and fitness programmes instead, but that would be too much like hard work.
Reply #11 Top

 

I didn't know that Hitler was alive and living in California.......

What's especially interesting is that leftists (who virtually rule California) call conservatives Nazis. Such a suggestion could have come direct from the blueprints of the Third Reich.

Maybe there should be mandatory health and fitness programmes instead, but that would be too much like hard work.

Or maybe, just maybe, we should stop insisting that the GOVERNMENT knows what's best for us. Even the idea of MANDATORY health and fitness programs is anathema to liberty.

Yes, health and fitness is a good idea, but the only justification for making it mandatory would be the concept that we are the property of the state, which is a concept imbedded in socialist and feudal ideas, and NOT in any way consistent with a democracy.

Reply #12 Top
Remember that movie with Ethan Hawke and Uma Thurman..can't think of the name? Was it Gothica? Anyway, it was about genetics and who is the perfect human, being up there in the perfect world, having all the cool stuff, job, etc. I would hate to see our society become like that. Warped, really warped! But you give these people an inch, and allow them to take liberties, where will they stop and when will it end? Nobody knows...


It's Gattaca. Gothica is the one with Halle Berry.

I blame my weight on nobody but myself.  I have an autoimmune disease and no longer have a thyroid, yet I know it is what I feed myself and my love of my couch that causes my weight problem.  I guess I must be unique


Self-responsibility? Do not dare speak of such hateful concepts!

I just don't understand when obesity became such a problem. I mean I'm not saying it's not a problem, but it never crossed my mind that obesity is such a problem that sterility would seem like the solution.
Reply #14 Top

Woah! atleast we know who the fat ppl of joeuser are now

Boy, you really know how to add to a conversation.  Considering the "wit" involved, I assume you are about 13- otherwise, that would be too pathetic.....

Reply #15 Top
Woah! atleast we know who the fat ppl of joeuser are now


Well, I am not obese, but one doesn't have to be fat to see how awful it is to treat the obese as some sort of subhuman group of defects. I mean, so what if they're unhealthy. Some of the most unhealthy people live long happy lives!
Reply #16 Top

one doesn't have to be fat to see how awful it is to treat the obese as some sort of subhuman group of defects. I mean, so what if they're unhealthy

Not all "fat" people are unhealthy.  Not all "skinny" people are healthy.  Just like not all smokers die of lung cancer.  There are a lot of factors involved.  Considering that we have a growing percentage of overweight people, as a society, we need to address it as a problem and work for a solution.  I just don't think sterilization is the answer, and neither is risky stomach surgery. 

I wish I could find it again, but there was a study by one of the big medical colleges on financial standing and weight problems.  It found that the most obese people were the poorer people.  It also evaluated the cost of healthy food versus non-healthy food.  It showed that the grocery bill of a list of fresh food, proper amounts of fresh fruits and veggies, and healthy protein costs about 50 - 75% more than a list that contained pre-packaged foods that were either frozen or preserved.  So, they tried to prove that it costs more to eat healthy.  Then add "organic" foods to the mix, and it gets even more expensive.

I shop at Whole Foods, which carries a lot of Organic foods and foods that pass their "healthy" test.  I buy as many Organic products as I can, and over 75% of my cart is filled with fresh fruits and veggies.  My grocery bill if literally double what it was when I used to buy "quick" type meals and the minimum amount of conventionally grown fruits and veggies. 

Reply #17 Top

I wish I could find it again, but there was a study by one of the big medical colleges on financial standing and weight problems. It found that the most obese people were the poorer people. It also evaluated the cost of healthy food versus non-healthy food. It showed that the grocery bill of a list of fresh food, proper amounts of fresh fruits and veggies, and healthy protein costs about 50 - 75% more than a list that contained pre-packaged foods that were either frozen or preserved. So, they tried to prove that it costs more to eat healthy. Then add "organic" foods to the mix, and it gets even more expensive.

In our long range plans to market farm on our small parcel of land, we're hoping to grow organic quality foods without the organic label (which is, by the way, a marketing tool like anything else). The problem is, if we spend the money for organic certification, we'll be expected to sell at "competitive" prices (read: vastly inflated). So, our goal is to produce naturally grown foods at prices competitive with mass marketed produce (the way we intend to make a profit is by growing things like tomatoes in the middle of winter, when they fetch the highest price, etc).

Personally, I love healthy foods. Give me a good veggie sandwich on whole grain bread, and I'll choose it over a steak almost any day of the week. But fresh produce doesn't keep as long, necessitating more trips to the grocery store and a higher net cost for even those who CAN afford all organics.

Back to topic, though...I am obese, and am winning the battle against it, but NOT ONE of my five children is obese. We've taught them healthy eating habits from the beginning, and they are very active. My own personal problems stem from the fact that you can't just WISH away 34 years of damage.

Reply #19 Top
I read your article on Obese men and sterilization,you are kidding I am sure-but years ago 60 min had a program on sterilizing men who had commited reapeat sex crimes,the law found it was against their rights to sterilize them if they did not keep taking their provera. They have done many studies on men who have raped and killed repeatedly and that their testosterone levels were so high they couldn't even be measured.I wonder why this has never come up again?I would be more worried over these disgusting products of society do not reproduce.Don't forget the fat guy can lose wt.,The sex offenders of our world are the people that should be castrated,sterilized,and wear a code on their ankles so they will never be alone and have another opportunity to hurt our loved ones of this world.