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"Christmas" - why do we celebrate it like we do?

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"Christmas" - why do we celebrate it like we do?

Traditions are odd things....

from JoeUser Forums

Christmas is an interesting time of year for me.  I’m not Christian.  I’m not any “religion”.  That is not to say that I am atheist, because I am not.  I just haven’t decided yet what I should believe.  But, with that, I end up questioning everything.  One of my biggest questions for winter is: “Why do we celebrate “Christmas” and why do we associate certain things with it?”

This is *not* an anti-Christian article.  It’s an article about history and tradition.  Many things have evolved over time, and “Christmas” is one of them.

-Jesus was not born on Christmas day, or really even close to it.  According to some bible scholars, he was born on

-Christmas trees really have nothing to do with Christmas.  They have been used as far back as we can tell for Solstice and Equinox celebrations.  Many religions used them as a way of praying to the “sun god” as a way of making him feel better.  (During the dark times of year, they thought that the god was sick and that evergreens would help the god get better). 

-On the Christmas tree note, the trees were not cut down.  Branches were removed, or the entire tree was moved.  When they started being brought in side, they were planted in planters then brought in.  They were used as a celebration of life during the “death” of winter.

-“Yule time” has nothing to do with “Christmas”.  It is a Norse tradition that pre-dates Jesus.  It was celebrated on the 21st of December.

-The 12 days of Christmas is from the same “Yule” tradition.  They would burn a giant log (Yule log) and feast and celebrate while it burned.  This log typically took 12 days to burn.

-It is believed that the Christian church adopted the 25th as the official celebration date of Jesus’ birth as a way of absorbing the traditions of the Saturnalia festival, which was a pagan festival which honors the God of agriculture “Saturn”.  The 25th is also the day that Romans observed Juvenalia, which is a celebration of the children and the birthday of Mithra, the “god of the unconquerable sun”.

-Christmas wasn't declared a federal holiday in until

-During the Middle ages, Christmas was celebrated by attending church then celebrating in a drunken fashion, not unlike “Mardi Gras”. (Now, *that* is a tradition we should bring back! ;) )

There are many other traditions surrounding Christmas that are “odd”.  If you think of any that you don’t understand, let me know and I’ll see what I can dig up on them.  And, if you have some other info on it, reply with it.  I’d love to learn more!

 

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Reply #51 from JoeUser Forums Top
ight there is the bit that you are overlooking. You are saying that the bible is truly accurate. I am saying that it is possible that Jesus may have existed, was a great teacher, and was killed. The bible tells you why he was killed, and that he was the son of God.


You misunderstand. His date of death and crime are recorded. This isn't a matter of faith, just of history.

Can you *honestly* say that you can remove yourself from your Christian beliefs and look at Christianity with a free mind? Can you view the bible as tales told by men and not the word of God? If not, then you can't say that you can see a different viewpoint.


Yes, I can and have. To the point where for a time I doubted the accuracy of the bible. It took two years for me to decide that it was a reliable source.

Historical "proof" is quite weak when talking about things as old as when Jesus was alive. Most of the "proof" is more of an educated guess.


Now you're just rationalizing. You can discount any sort of proof with enough twisted logic, but Occam's razor will kill you before you get anywhere near discounting Roman crucifiction records.

If you learn about Jesus through the bible


You don't. I would want to know the colors of the United States flag and maybe have a clue who G.Washington was before I met the president, but that doesn't mean it's necessary in the strictest sense of the word. But I agree, it's certainly easier to find him if you know he's in the white house, and where that is. That, of course, is discounting the fact that the president is somewhat difficult to meet even if you do find him, and many would not if they had the chance.

What I'm trying to say is that I have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ that is entirely separate from my intellectual knowledge of Christianity. Others can have the same without that knowledge.

[quoteI]f they are not exposed to the bible or its teachings, how can they believe in something that they have never heard of? And, why would God devise a plan that would exclude such people?

You're speaking of things you don't understand. If you try to cut up the Christian philosophy into tiny chunks, of course it will fail. Everything a Christian believes is interrelated. You must keep in mind that people deserve to die. They are separated from God, and their sin makes them utterly unworthy to enter heaven. Nay, worse than that; they would be dangerous to let in, like a child with dirt on his feet running over white carpeting. God doesn't like dirt. In fact, he's one of the neatest dieties I know. So that's why cleanliness is next to godliness...

So we have two warring principles here. One:

"The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance." -2 Peter 3:9

i.e. God doesn't want anybody to go to Hell. Heck, who would?

Two, that he cannot allow the soiled to enter heaven. So those who accept his GIFT of salvation- and if you think I speak untrue, you will see that it waits in every hotel room in America, and in nearly every language known to man- may enter under a blanket of cleansing provided at a dear cost: the shame of God. You won't see it happen again this side of eternity, I expect.

As you see, God is not evil, but protective. Just as a hunter is sad to put down a rabid wolf-hound, so God is sad to damn his beloved- but he will not risk his church by setting loose that rapid dog. Or if you'd rather, think of it as a by-law. Wouldn't want to lower the property value in heaven by having pagans move in next door, now would we! I'm kidding, I'm kidding... well, mostly....

I'm glad you're asking questions though. It's rare that I meet an intelligent person that's knowledgable enough to present a strong case for riding the fence. On the matter of Jesus, I mean. Keep asking away!

Dan
Reply #52 from JoeUser Forums Top
Somehow, when I saw this topic, I knew it would ultimately degrade into a anti-jesus/anti-religion thread - which it already has apparently. I'm ascribed to the view that different people believe in god in their own ways, and religion isn't always a requirement to have belief and faith. However, I also acknowledge that our country was founded by people of deep faith, and to neglect that for fear of offending secular people is rediculous - its neglecting our heritage. Can you imagine if you moved to an Islamic country, and started trying to pass laws to ban Islam? Hah!

The extreme minority secularists in this country are getting pretty scary, you know, like how the school bus driver that was fired last week for playing Christmas music on her bus. Or the teacher that has his coursework censored, because it mentions God - that coursework is the declaration of independance I might add. Its sad really, how such a small minority in this country, is making so much noise.

I'm not an overly religious person, but I do believe in god. Its not surprising this country has undergone a conservative revolution based on moral values and god. I think its backlash over the secularist and liberals trying to forcefeed their agenda down everyones throats, then insulting people that don't adhere to their beliefs.
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Reply #53 from WinCustomize Forums Top

You're speaking of things you don't understand. If you try to cut up the Christian philosophy into tiny chunks, of course it will fail.

That didn't answer the question at all.

My viewpoint is that there is not only one path to God.  You say that there is, and it is through Jesus.  I have yet to have a Christian explain to me how people who know nothing of the bible and have never heard the term "Jesus" can get to heaven.  If you say that they can believe but call him a different name, then it's back to my original point of many paths and that all religions are pretty much the same, only the names are changed.

There is proof that Jesus existed and that he was killed.  I don't dispute that.  However, the bible is a different story.  If you have never attended church and have never had anyone "interpret" it for you, it looks much different.  The "story" of Jesus is in the bible.  The proof that he existed is different.  The "proof" of dates is also a question, as there is great dispute over when Jesus was actually born.  As I said- you can believe that he existed and that he had great teachings without believing that he was the Messiah.  He may be the "son of God" in the same sense that all humans are the children of God.  You can't prove that the bible is fact, and you can't prove that Jesus is our "Savior".

I don't believe that Christian values are wrong.  I also have nothing against people who have strong faith.  But, to me, there are way too many unanswered questions like: (of course, my biggest one is the one I already mentioned about people who have never seen a bible), How come the bible doesn't mention dinosaurs?  How come the "dates" aren't real dates?  In the bible, God put Adam and Eve on the Earth, then there were all these other people- where did they come from?  How can you take words at face value that we translated from words that could have more than one meaning (since the Hebrew ('Nephesh') and Greek ('Psuche') words which have been translated 'soul' in the Bible  could also mean:  Person, Breath, Heart, Creature,  Mind, or Himself)?  Can you trust a human to interpret God's words?  Why would I need a book to tell me to believe in God?  If we are made in God's image, why do the people on Earth look so very different from each other?.....etc, etc...

I *wish* that I could believe in Christianity.  I have really tried.  I have yet to have a Christian give me a good reason to believe- a reason that does not require a reference to the bible.  As is, I still stick with my "Buddhism with a Transcendental twist" (that got us into trouble in the past, didn't it?).  I believe that there was a creator.  I don't know if I believe that there is a "God" that has a magical place called heaven (though I wish I could).  I believe that people should lead clean, productive lives that benefit themselves and mankind.  And, in the end, our energy returns to an oversoul to be distributed to another living thing. 

The extreme minority secularists in this country are getting pretty scary, you know, like how the school bus driver that was fired last week for playing Christmas music on her bus. Or the teacher that has his coursework censored, because it mentions God - that coursework is the declaration of independance I might add. Its sad really, how such a small minority in this country, is making so much noise.

I have to agree.  Even though I am not Christian, I don't see anything wrong with christianity.  There is nothing "evil" or morally corrupt about it.  To some people, it's the only thing that keeps them on the right moral track.  Our country was built on Christian beliefs, and it should stay that way.  We were also built on a "majority rules" system, and since the majority of the country is Christian, the rest of us should learn to live with it.  You don't have to believe in Christianity to tolerate it, just like you don't have to be homosexual to tolerate homosexuality.  But, just as I don't believe that our laws and values should change to allow homosexuals to marry, I also don't believe that our laws and values should change concerning "God" and Christianity.

Reply #54 from JoeUser Forums Top
Since Xmas went commercial, it is celebrated not by Christians per se but by giddy consumers!