Demolish and build, or upgrade?

from GalCiv2 Forums

Postulate the following:

1) You have just obtained a new planet with pre-existing improvements.  Maybe it was in trade, maybe influence, maybe invasion, maybe surrender - - no matter.  You didn't build what's there, but now you own it anyway.

2) Many of the improvements are ones you do not want.  For example, perhaps you do not want any research buildings (the tree could be researched out for you).  Perhaps there are four farms and you want only one.  Whatever the case, there are multiple whatzits you do not want.

3) You're paying per turn maintenance for the whatzits you do not want.  For example, the Discovery whatzit research building in DA is 4 BCs per turn.

4) I believe there is some credit applied when upgrading one structure into another.

5) Demolish all the unwanted whatzits and you pay no maintenance costs on them, but do not get any credit from them when building the whatzits you DO want.

6) Is there any rule of thumb on what is best when?  I sure do not want to micromanage doing a planet-by-planet, case-by-case analysis.  Still, one pays the maintenance turn after turn on all the whatzits even as they sit like parasites in the upgrade queue for dozens of turns.

What I've been doing - - right or wrong - - is demolishing all but maybe 2 of the unwanted whatzits and upgrading the others.  For example, one planet had 14 research structures, 13 of which had 4 BC per turn maintenance.  What I wanted was a few factories, another farm, maybe a morale building, and the rest stock exchanges.  I demolished all but 3, put in upgrades for two of the research buildings into factories, and then the third (which had only 1 BC maintenance) last into whatever it was I wanted next, then filled the queue with fresh improvements to be built on the cleared ground.

It seemed reasonable, but my tactics could be completely wrong.  Help?!?

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Reply #1 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Look at it in terms of productivity, not maintenance. Having a research building you don't need sit there and generate social points through focus can get you the new structures faster. Generally, faster buildings will outweigh spending an extra 10-20bc a turn on maintenance. Depending on your slider settings, 50+ bc mainenance may be worthwhile, and upgrading will cut the cost of those stock markets in half, at least.

Unfortunately, to truly maximize return it doesn't need to be done on a planet-by-planet basis, but on a building-by-building basis. You will usually get some credit for upgrading instead of building, but that credit is highly variable and not easily determined. Two identical reseach structures may give 0% credit and 100+% credit, depending on *how* they were built. You get credit for how many MP went into the structure when it was built, so if it was rush bought at 0%, no MP were used and no credit is given. If it was built entirely and more MP were used to build it than were strictly needed, you will get credit for the entire MP usage, not just the cost of the building.

Example: Research Centers cost 100MP to build. If the planet was spending 16 MP on social production for all seven turns it took to build at that rate, you would get 112 points of credit when upgrading the building. A stock market costs 120, so you could easily build it in one turn

If the building has more credit than the new structure needs, you don't get it free. You will spend 40-50 MP (or however the math works out, I know it will cost you 436 to rush buy) to get your building, whatever it is. Note this may be more than the building is worth. If you are upgrading, plan to build expensive things like high end factories and CE buildings on other high-cost structures, as this will save you the most time and money. If you see any building take only one turn to upgrade, at least look into rush buying it. You may get a factory or CE for as little as 6bc (meaning you got credit for all but one MP needed), and that is hardly worth wasting a turn

In general, upgrade to factories first, then other high cost buildings, then stock markets, morale and farms when they become necessary (farms will likely be cheaper to destroy and rebuild). This lets you use the productivity of the existing buildings to speed up your construction, you get to use the credit for upgrading, and the maintenance bill will drop as stuff gets done.

Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Are you saying that setting focus on social will make a planet with 10 research structures produce more social points despite the empire-wide slider set at zero research than an identical planet with no research structures with the slider set at at zero research?

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Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

At zero research, no. This was assuming you were using a split spend, not all factory. At that point all they can give you is the build credit. You will need to do the math on a per planet basis to see if the saved money from the build credit, which can still be considerable.

Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Okay - in this example (for simplicity) I had postulated that all desired research had been completed.  So, even if one had not started with all-factory, that would be the case now.  So, it would be 50-50-0, or maybe 1-99-0.

Still, this brings up another point.  The initial colony structure produces research creds, IIRC.  Otherwise, moving the slider over to increase research percentage would yield no research creds in the absence of research structures (unless one used focus onto research on a planet).  You would be right that moving the slider to more research then putting focus back to social for the postulated newly acquired planet would speed upgrades.  The Q would be if - other than the initial colony structures use for worthless research - would social go down on all other planets despite the absence of research strutures to consume the resources directed by the slider move?  Some of the waste could be recaptured on all those other planets by focus back to social or mil.  Where on balance does that put you?

I don't know that one, but the initial colony structure on each planet would certainly waste some. 

Reply #5 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

It would waste quite a bit. I don't recall exactly how much it generates, but the original colony building generates at least as much research as a medium-high end research structure (maybe 10?). Spread over your entire empire, that's a lot of money getting spent, so unless you have scores of planets you need to upgrade it's definitely not worth screwing with your sliders.

And yes, social would go down on all planets, with or without research structures. All factory output will be cut by the percentage you moved to research production.

Reply #6 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

Well because finances are so pathetic in this game i usually demolish everything and just build markets everywhare with 1 farm, 1 morale building and a starport. Honestly, this game should be called market civilisations, not galactic civilisations!

The only non market buildings i keep are 1 of a kind buildings or buildings on the correct tile bonus which is rare for the AI to get rite! I find there is never any benefit to building on an existing structure, even my own structures. I understand there is supposed to be some benefit, but it just dousn't happen in my game, never has, not once, so there is no reason not to demolish everything i want to replace.... unless i leave factories to help my stock markets get build quicker over the top of them, that is the only exception.