how do I...

let me get some screenys together for you......

I'll show you a cool trick.

Just make the 'placehold' a part of the captionbar graphics.
Then it'll always be visible.

(Hope I understood the problem correct)

Like this:

yes, I kind of know about this one, what I was wondering is how to add extra buttons/images that are used just for fluff. If you have time and want to, take a look at tiggs Kay2 (if I write it as , I get this) blind and the various buttons he has in addition to the close/max/min/restore/help buttons. just wanting to expand my abilities here. thanks for helping.

if you are using UIS 2 frames you can add buttons, with pre made functions.. You can also add buttons on pp frames.

Its under "Edit Titlebars and WindowFrames" then under "Edit PerPixel buttons" or "Edit UIS2 frames".

Or as snowman said if it isnt supposed to have a function just "paint" it on the frame gfx's.

not working but I thank you two for helping. as a rule, I am not able to change the names of the title bar buttons, if I attempt to do so, nothing happens and the default image remains. I have clicked on the "add" button and that works but I am unable to add the image. what's in a name, eh?

That section (in your screenshot) is the section for the UIS2 caption buttons. Per pixel frames in most cases override UIS2 frames. So if you have skinned the per pixel frames/buttons, you won't see the UIS2 frames/buttons. That is to say; very few applications make use of non per pixel windows.

Does that make sense?

I believe it does. by incorporating per pixel frames and buttons those images will become the default. and as the button images can be named anything they should import. And I guess by inferrence that I can do per pixel buttons without making per pixel frames??

per pixel buttons are specificly for the perpixel frames, and your frames will have no buttons if they arent done.

are you asking if yr uis buttons can be png? if so.....yes of course.

but if your talking about pp buttons in general in relation to the pp frames.......they have to be done together, and besides, most frames are pp, not uis, so to not have them is a bit short changing, if you know what i mean.

I can see with your type of blind that pp is necessary to create the designs you use. I have used both pp and uis frames/buttons but I found that pp frame reduces my right/left frame sides down to 4 pixels when the window is maximized. I don't appear to have the need to include pp graphics. My blinds are generally rectangles while you got the curves.

you also lose dropshadowing and antialiasing without per pixel frames.

I haven't had the opportunity to use a dropshadow with my frames and I would compensate the lose of antialiasing with gaussian blur and outer bevel but your point is well taken. hmm, I'll have to think on this some more expecially with the WIP.

and translucency. but the most important thing is no jaggy edges, hate that jaggy edges

most rectangle blinds still have a beautiful but subtle curved edge....vstyler and mikeb are good at that...... i hope you change yr mind about pp frames......i think they are awsome.