Abortion

The unborn differ from the newborn in four ways...

For those of you who are pro-choice or pro-abortion, do you really think that the fetus isn't a living, breathing being? Or do you believe that it's truly okay to kill a baby, a living human being? If it's the latter, you are sick. And if it's the former, I guess you're just plain uninformed, or choose to deny the fact that from the day of conception all human chromosomes are present and a unique human life begins.

Did you know...

Day 22 – The baby’s heart begins to beat with the child’s own blood – often a different blood type than the mother.
Week 6 – At this stage, brain waves can be detected. The child’s mouth and lips are present and fingers are forming.
Week 8 – At this stage, every organ is in place. Bones and unique fingerprints begin to form.
Week 17 – The baby can now have dream (REM) sleep.

The unborn differ from the newborn in four ways that have disqualified them as persons (according to some pro-abortion advocates).

1. Size or Physical Appearance – Do humans lose value when they don’t look right? Does size equal value? Men are generally larger than women. Does that mean men are more human than women? Shaquille O’Neil is larger than Hillary Clinton. Does that mean Hillary Clinton is less human than Shaq? The term used to describe the destruction of groups of people based on their physical appearance is ethnic cleansing or genocide. But human value transcends physical appearance. Therefore, “not looking right” cannot disqualify a human being from being valuable.

2. Level of Development – Is a person’s value defined by his abilities, by what he can or can’t do? Do we forfeit our rights as human persons because we don’t have the capabilities others have? Do stronger, more capable, more intelligent people have more rights than others? Do human beings become disposable simply because at their level of development they are helpless, defenseless, and dependent? Human value transcends abilities or the lack of abilities. Therefore, missing abilities cannot disqualify human value.

3. Environment – Do humans forfeit their worth when they change locations? Baby Rachel was born prematurely at 24 weeks. She weighed only 1 lb. 9 oz., but dropped to just under 1 lb. soon after. She was so small she could rest in the palm of her daddy’s hand. She was a tiny, living, person. Heroic measures were taken to save her life. If a doctor had killed Rachel we would have recoiled in horror. However, if this same little girl was inches away from the outside world, resting inside her mother’s womb, she could be legally killed by abortion. Clearly, one’s environment can’t be the deciding factor. Changing locations is morally trivial. Environment has no bearing on who we are.

4. Degree of Dependency – Is human value determined by our degree of dependency on others? The unborn’s dependency on his mother for sustenance is irrelevant to the baby’s value. No baby is “viable” if degree of dependency matters. All babies need their mothers for feeding whether via blood (an umbilical cord), breast, or bottle. Human beings may be dependent on others for their survival, but they aren’t dependent on others for their value. All physically dependent people are at risk if degree of dependency determines their value – those dependent on kidney machines, pacemakers, and insulin would have to be declared non-persons. Dependency does not determine worth.

Just because this living being is growing inside of another person, doesn't give that person the right to murder him/her. Wishful thinking may lead us to believe that a fetus isn't living, and just because of the four reasons above doesn't qualify as a human being. I beg to differ.

~Sarah

1,610 views 12 replies
Reply #1 Top
For those of you who are pro-choice or pro-abortion, do you really think that the fetus isn't a living, breathing being?


Yes, I do, and no I am not mis-informed.

Sarah, if you really want to try to encourage people to see your point of view, it doesn't help you at all to put them on the defensive in the first sentence. Simply because I do not hold the same opinion as you makes me neither sick nor ill-informed.


I don't understand the argument about size and physical appearance at all. Who says, "I believe that a woman's right to choose is paramount because the fetus is ugly."

I understand that you believe that life begins at conception, and I am glad that you have strong convictions. However, there is no clear cut "life begins now" point that has been realized by doctors and scientists. People disagree--professionals in the field disagree. If it were as easy as you make it out to be, there would be no debate.

However, if this same little girl was inches away from the outside world, resting inside her mother’s womb, she could be legally killed by abortion.


What state allows for abortions at 24 weeks? That would be six months, which is third trimester, which, is outlawed in all 50 states.
Reply #2 Top

What state allows for abortions at 24 weeks? That would be six months, which is third trimester, which, is outlawed in all 50 states


24 weeks is also the age of viability, where professionals agree that the fetus has a chance of survival outside the womb - with the required medical support, of course.


I'm pro choice.  Having been there myself, I realize that I am in no position to tell anyone else what they're doing is 'wrong' or 'sick'.  I know I wouldn't have wanted someone telling me that when I had to decide.

Reply #3 Top
What state allows for abortions at 24 weeks? That would be six months, which is third trimester, which, is outlawed in all 50 states.


Actually at the stage of six months a "Prostagladin Chemical Abortion" can take place. This form of abortion uses chemicals developed by the Upjohn Pharmaceutical Co., which cause the uterus to contract (to push) intensely, pushing out the developing baby. The contractions are more violent than normal, natural contractions, so they frequently kill the unborn baby -- some have even been decapitated. Many, however, have also been born alive. I have never heard of this type of abortion but have seen it listed in many places now that I have looked at.

I don't understand the argument about size and physical appearance at all. Who says, "I believe that a woman's right to choose is paramount because the fetus is ugly."


Basically, in the studies I have researched and the logical conclusions I have come to the fetus is a living breathing being from conception. No one is saying anything about a woman being able to choose because of the physical appearance of the baby. The point was that size doesn't make one person more human than another. Just because I'm taller than my brother doesn't give me more rights.

I'm just curious: when do you think the fetus becomes human?

Thanks for your comments, ladies. Sorry, shades, if I put you in the defensive right away. That wasn't my intention.

~Sarah
Reply #4 Top
First, Sarah. All I have to say is "AMEN!"

Second...although I know that the first cells that develop are part of the placenta, I believe that the fetus becomes human at the moment of conception. The sperm and egg in question are human in orgin, and therefore, a human lifeform is in development. I don't suppose that makes much sense...but....I don't know. Life is a miracle to me. There are SO many things that COULD go wrong with pregnancies (miscarriages, defects, etc)...and the vast majority of pregnancies are normal and the baby is healthy! It's amazing to me. And to me, there has to be divine intervention involved.

But...I'm an ostrich girl.

~Moo
Reply #5 Top
Actually at the stage of six months a "Prostagladin Chemical Abortion" can take place. This form of abortion uses chemicals developed by the Upjohn Pharmaceutical Co., which cause the uterus to contract (to push) intensely, pushing out the developing baby. The contractions are more violent than normal, natural contractions, so they frequently kill the unborn baby -- some have even been decapitated. Many, however, have also been born alive. I have never heard of this type of abortion but have seen it listed in many places now that I have looked at.


At six months, this procedure is illegal in every state. That was my point. Even states that do not have unconstitutional bans on abortion, have bans on abortion post-viability. Determinations of viability differ among states, but the general rule of thumb that ProChoice America works with is 20 weeks or 5 months. After that time, abortion is no longer a legal choice. Pro-Choice America does not oppose post-viability abortion bans. According to their website, ProChoice America "supports the legal framework established in Roe v. Wade and does not oppose restrictions on post-viability abortions so long as they contain adequate exceptions to protect the life and health of the woman."

I'm just curious: when do you think the fetus becomes human?

I can't answer this question. I do not have the background or the expertise to even begin to formulate a theory about when the fetus turns from a group of cells to a living breathing baby. But it is also not a question that is new to our socieity. St. Augustine struggled for years to determine when the soul entered the body. For me, the fetus becomes human when it has a soul, but I can not pinpoint that moment and law can not be established based on a religious doctrine of "when the soul enters the body."

Whether or not I would ever have an abortion is a different story. I used to say never. But I haven't been in the situation where I have had to seriously consider the option. I can say what my response would be if I was confronted with that choice. I firmly support the right to choose. I don't need a bunch of old men in Congress and the Supreme Court deciding what is best for a 14 year old low-income, inner-city rape victim.

And to me, there has to be divine intervention involved

Can't the same thing be said on the other side of the coin? Maybe it is God's will that certain fetuses (feti?) are not born...Who knows? I just know that I am not capable of making the decision to force people to carry to term fetuses that are not wanted.

Reply #6 Top

Great article, Sarah!


I'll be honest... I'm all right with abortion until brainwaves are detected. Unless I'm mistaken, the brain is one of the most important and irreplaceable organs on the human body. One knows when one is dead when their brain no longer functions. As long as it still functions, they are still alive. It also can't be replaced, and even if could be replaced, I have a feeling that a person with a brand new brain would be a completely different person.


24 weeks is also the age of viability, where professionals agree that the fetus has a chance of survival outside the womb - with the required medical support, of course.


But the child still cannot survive on its own, so shouldn't the hospital and/or the mother still have the choice to abort it then?  Same with people who need a medical implant to live. Since the person would not be alive if not for whomever supplied the technology, the ones supplying the technology should have the right to choose whether that person continues to live... or is aborted. Their body. Their choice.

Reply #7 Top
At six months, this procedure is illegal in every state. That was my point.


Sorry, you're right. At first I was under the impression that it was legal in the US.

The point in all this is, why doesn't the baby/fetus (whatever you want to call it) have a say in his/her life? "Duh, Sarah, uhh, 'cuz they can't talk?" So does that mean that if a 6 month old can be killed just because the mother doesn't want to take on the responsibility or give him/her up for adoption? Does that mean that if you had a severly handicapped (mentally) child that you should be able to have the right to terminate it's life because they can't tell you they want to live? Come on. At week 8, every organ is in place. But maybe it's still just a blob of nothing... hmm... Take any "born" person for example. If their heart is beating, they're pronounced alive, correct? At day 22, a baby's heart begins to beat. How can you say it's not alive when it's in the womb, even if it's heart is beating?

~Sarah
Reply #8 Top
I think you are misinformed about pro-choicers if you believe they are blanketly all misinformed. Most popular debates have people who know their shit on both sides and a large percentage of people jumping on bandwagons without putting in any really deep thought or consideration of counterarguments.

People have different opinions. It's a grey area and not everyone chooses to see it as straightforwardly as you, even if this does make life easier. But I'd be interested to see. I just posted a long blog about abortion in which I covered all the grey areas, why don't you come look and then tell me if you still think we're all a bunch of dimwits. I have raised a whole bunch of questions that I think usually go unanswered in this debate, perhaps you would care to enlighten us on what you have to say about them. I leave them unanswered for the most part, but I doubt if you will take such a path. But just try to see if you can open your mind for half a sec to arguments from both sides. You may even find yourself uncomfortable with some of it because I refuse to land straight down on one side. Go with that uncomfortability and challenge your own opinions as I did last night whilst watching a live abortion. So far your argumentation is too superficial and simplistic to convince me.
Reply #9 Top
In the scientific community, the heated discussion about the ethics in regards to abortion is not whether or not the fetus is a living thing - there is no question that the foetus is a living thing. Indeed, the argument that is of greater concern is whether the fetus is a person or not.
Reply #10 Top
I am pro-choice. If fetus are doomed to become a person that needs life support his or her entire life, or massively deformed, it should be aborted.

Yes, it includes ones that mothers to be just don't want to have babies, but we already got 8 billion humans on earth now? Anyway there is so many humans that one unborn don't hurt human vitality at all.
Reply #11 Top

I am pro-choice. If fetus are doomed to become a person that needs life support his or her entire life, or massively deformed, it should be aborted.


Yes, it includes ones that mothers to be just don't want to have babies, but we already got 8 billion humans on earth now? Anyway there is so many humans that one unborn don't hurt human vitality at all.


That's one of many reasons why I feel that people on any sort of unnatural life support, even if no longer inside the womb, should be abortable.

Reply #12 Top
Anyway there is so many humans that one unborn don't hurt human vitality at all.


By that same argument: there are already enough humans, so no one will mind if I knock you off right now...