when it comes to propogating idiocy, lil lost dani just can't help hisself.

they did.

so your saying that stalin wasn't a jew. prove it.

Yeah, I VOTE! I've probably voted more times than most here because of my age. I'm like Snidely. I remember all the times they have stuck it up our buns! I take it very seriously. I felt so cheated when Bush STOLE the election from Al Gore. Had it fixed in Florida by his brother. How nice! Believe it! I spent most of my life in Chicago so I know how that works. Hell jamespaulp, you just raised up another reason to BASH BUSH! It's such an easy thing to do ya know.

Voting doesn't mean anything if ya vote for the wrong people! Maybe that's yer point but that doen't mean you shouldn't vote. It's just like the point that unclerob was making about alternate energy, the right thing is there. You just have to do it. People are easily lead astray. They believe that Mr. Rogers was a Green Beret and killed people. They believe that John Wayne was a real patriot when in fact he was a whoring drunkard. They believe that Dubya is an honest god fearing man from Texas when in fact he's a spoiled Ivy League punk who failed at everything until Karl Rove and Dick Cheney made him their puppet stooge and the American people don't seem to mind that. Ya gotta ask yourself why? Any ideas out there?

the man stated that he couldn't be anti Jew because his grandmother was a Jew.


i was pointing out that the two most dangers people to the Jews in the 20Th century were both Jews.

hitler killed 6 million. stalin sent even more to prison.

The truth is always the first casualty when politicians use deceit and rhetoric to conceal hidden agendas, whose casualties then include the innocent victims of their dubious decisions. Guess that's why I have the utmost respect AND sympathy for those sent into battle....for they are also casualties of the fabricated truth the public is fed to justify the means, in fact, more-so. Sadly, your own combatants are victims just as much as those they're sent to fight...then there's all the collateral damage to innocent civilians,their families,property and homes.

I know that if I were even partly responsible for the kinds of horror inflicted by war, whether I was sent there or not, I'd still feel a certain amount of guilt and shame, suffering eternal nightmares that I had in some way contributed to wreaking havoc, death and destruction on other humans lives. Yeah, I know there are some who think of people like me as being a woos and coward, but I'll apologise to no-one for having the compassion and humanity for wishing that everyone, including my supposed enemies, would be spared the first casualty of war to avoid all the others.

i don't remember who said it but truth is the first casualty of any war. this was said a long time before bush took office.


the second truth of any war is that god is on our side. doesn't matter who we are.

That's a fallacy, if you're a God fearing Christian...Christ was a vocal opponent war and condemned needless acts of violence at every turn, saying that it is better to turn the other cheek than strike your enemy, even in self defense. Therefore, if the Son of God says it is wrong to strike out, then God is not going to be with those who strike first in an act of aggression. An no, I'm not religious, devoutly or otherwise, though I've had a fair few religious canvassers leave my place shaking their heads over my understanding of the Bible and God's will. In fact, I've had some looking for excuses to leave (rather than try putting their foot in the door) when I bounce their false belief/ideals right back at them with Biblical knowledge to justify my refusal to bow to religious indoctrination.

I'm not too sure that I even believe in God, in the traditional sense, at least, but I surely believe in Jesus Christ, whether he was the son of God or not, because too much historical evidence exists to say that he surely did exist....and for me, his teachings and beliefs are good examples as to how we could all live, as pacifists who respect all human life and refuse to take it.

Yeah, I'm a pacifist and I don't give a stuff who thinks that's girlie, I know that if I am to stand before my maker on Judgement Day, I'll be judged for perpetuating pirate threads at WC and some curried cabbage related air pollution.

just before we attacked Iraq bush prayed.

the terrorists say that Allah has ordered the death of the great Satan.


Hitler blessed world war 2. he made himself god.


Stalin did the same thing.


show me a war where someone on both side didn't say that god was on their side.

Granada doesn't count.



i am not saying it is true. i am just saying that both sides says that god is on their side. Japanese emperor was considered to be god as well.

Here's an article about how bad Bush really is WWW Link suggests he's the worst US president of all time. Guess tho, there isn't a US publication....heck, a publication anywhere that hasn't run an article or 3 like it.

Yes, I am. Let's take a look at your list.

Good for you. Nothing much to talk about it


Still runs on fossil fuel 100%.


Still runs on fossil fuel 100%. Just most efficient.

Still runs on fossil fuel > 90 %. Where do you think the electricity come from? Wind, Solar, Hydro, Nuclear? I'll give it a 10%. I could be wrong about the percentage point, but that is not the point.

Same as #5

You need more land than the whole country (take any country) to get enough biodiesel to be completely fossil fuel independent.

You are kidding, right?

Again, what is the source of ethanol? How can we have enough ethanol to replace our need for fossil fuel?

Same as #8

Now where does the hydrogen come from? Run a pipe to a hydrogen star? If you have to generate hydrogen here on earth we need to split water or some other kind of chemical reaction that costs more energy than what the hydrogen will give us. Thermodynamics, hello!
Solar, may be someday. Not with current technology and solar cell efficiency.

I see that   
No offence, but it is very easy to get carried away.

All I am saying is that there are no technologies with exception of nuclear power that can realistically get us out of the woods.

Sorry dude....my bad! It just gets me going whenever I see that thrown out there.

I totally understand.

stalin (not his birth name btw) was ethnic georgian. as a boy, he attended a georgian orthodox school at which he earned a scholarship to a georgian orthodox theological seminary where he was being prepared to become a priest.

gotta stop taking everything you read in those lil neo-nazi comix as historical fact.

If God's on our side
He'll stop the next war.
--bob dylan, 'with god on our side'

"And tonight I have a message for the brave and oppressed people of Iraq: Your enemy is not surrounding your country -- your enemy is ruling your country. (Applause.) And the day he and his regime are removed from power will be the day of your liberation. (Applause.) State of the Union Address, 2003

Granted, it wasn't mentioned in the speech enough to consider it a primary justification, but the fact it was mentioned shows that liberating the people of Iraq was not a recent afterthought either.

As for the "yellowcake" situation, while the press made a huge circus out of Joe Wilson's trip to Niger, and conclusions that Hussein never did attempt to buy yellowcake from Niger... They all but ignored the fact that Joe Wilson's conclusions differed from what the PM of Niger really told him.

"The unanimous Intelligence Committee found that the CIA report, based on Wilson's mission, differed considerably from the former ambassador's description to the committee of his findings.

That report "did not refute the possibility that Iraq had approached Niger to purchase uranium." As far as his statement to The Washington Post about "forged documents" involved in the alleged Iraqi attempt to buy uranium, Wilson told the committee he may have "misspoken." In fact, the intelligence community agreed that "Iraq was attempting to procure uranium from Africa."

"While there was no dispute with the underlying facts," Chairman Roberts wrote separately, "my Democrat colleagues refused to allow" two conclusions in the report. The first conclusion merely said that Wilson was sent to Niger at his wife's suggestion. The second conclusion is devastating:

"Rather than speaking publicly about his actual experiences during his inquiry of the Niger issue, the former ambassador seems to have included information he learned from press accounts and from his beliefs about how the Intelligence Community would have or should have handled the information he provided." ~
Errant former ambassador: Robert Novak

More selective competence by the press.

Stalin was a Jewish Moscow coffee house radical

In the Georgian language "shvili" means son of, or son, as in Johnson. "Djuga" means Jew. Therefore Djugashvili means Jewison. [Jewish son or son of a Jewish man]

So Joe Stalin's real name, before he changed it, was Joe Jewison. It gets better, his name was Joseph David Djugashvili, a typical Jewish name. During his revolutionary days he changed his name to "Kochba", the leader of the Jews during one of the anti-Roman uprisings of the Jews. Russians don't change their names. Georgians don't change their names. Jews change their names. Do a search on google.com and yahoo on Kochba.


there you go stalin was a jew


you don't have to follow the jewish faith to be a jew.

like i said, you're an idiot who too very quickly and easily accepts whatever hateful bullshit you find on neo-nazi sites such as the one pointed to by the link you provided.

Does that mean clever intelligent people will take  longer to accept whatever hateful bullshit they find?

Or...

Has fair and reasonable debate degraded to condemnation and name-calling?

Let's attack the premise [opinion], not the person.

The only one TRUTH about politics [at any level] is that ...

"Politicians are like nappies [diapers] they need frequent changing...and much for the same reasons"....

nice one Jafo

If someone could remove the link in post # 118 that would be special.

Something many here are forgetting is the fact that around the time of the invasion Islamic extremism began to rise and has blossomed since. The intent of these people is to spread Islam throughout the World. It is their view that either we convert to Islam or die as infidels. There is no negotiation with them on this point. Already they have destabilized Afghanistan, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Many African states and are now lining up India. Europe has become a battleground with frequent bomb attacks across the region. Terror cells are springing up everywhere under the banner of Islam. This is a direct attack on our freedom. A direct attack on our way of living. If we want to continue to live as we have become accustomed then at some point we have to defend that right to our own freedom or these people will take it away. I agree with everyone here and as a veteran I fully concur that war is not a likeable outcome. We can whinge and moan about rights and wrongs but bottom line we have a requirement currently to defend our lands against these Islamic terrorists. They are not going to go away. As for Sadam....he signed up unconditionally to agreements, sixteen in all, and he never abided by one of them. These agreements were made with the World as a whole. Not just the US. Twelve years of talking got us nowhere.We have a rightful expectation to ensure people stick to international agreements especially ones as serious as Saddam signed up to. He was openly threatening Israel and the US and Kuwait. He was using chemical weapons on his own people and massacring Kurds by the thousands. Prior to Gulf War one he was actively engaged in producing nuclear weaponry. Inspectors uncovered that after two years of hard looking which Saddam hindered all the way.No one who opposed this invasion has ever come up with an alternative solution to solving the clear threat Saddam was.Scratch talking off the list. We know that did not work. One week before the invasion both Tony Blair and George Bush were imploring Saddam to abide by his agreements. Russia and China both tried to get him to abide by them also in that week. He basically stuck his thumb up and said"Sod the lot of you...bring it on". I am still waiting for those who opposed the war to explain how they would have got compliance from Saddam.To ignore him would have sent entirely the wrong message......to leave him unattended and free to continue would have seen just as great a disaster. Kurds would have been killed to the man woman and child. Shia would likely have suffered the same fate and Israel would most definitely have come under missile attack from Iraqs new long range missiles. Bush and Blair had the conviction to hold Saddam accountable to the letter of his world agreements. It is a shame other cosignatories had not the same intestinal fortitude. That and Rumsfelds woeful mismanagement of the invasion is why we have the mess we have. Rumsfeld withdrew the need for troops to follow up the mechanised divisions to secure and stabilise the ground taken....hence the looting and damage and growth of the insurgency. He was told 500,000 troops would be required. He went in with a deficit of close on half. 250,000 TROOPS short of the recommended amount. Thank you for your expertise Mr Donald Rumsfeld!

In my reply #73 what I was attempting to convey is that with the current mind set of our Governments and Political leaders we may change the person but we won't change their actions or the outcome. Jafo makes a reference to "Every generation needs its Vietnam". If the statement was made I'm thinking that possibly it was made thinking of another statement. Mankind or if you like the human race is doomed to make the same mistakes of their fathers, grandfathers and their fathers due solely for their lack of knowledge of history. How many countless wars have taken place in the name of freedom, or the best ever religion. How many in the Middle East alone, carefull you may need a calculator.

I think you are spot on. Perhaps it is the lack of a nod to history that drives me most crazy about our current mistakes. Many just say "hind sight is 20/20". Well, that's true. But foresight can be pretty damned good when you take historical record in mind.

As far as George Bush goes, well, actions speak louder than words.....
and his actions have spoken volumes.....

I can honestly say that I didn't vote for him (either election), and I'm honestly ashamed that he got elected....twice! He lied, and those lies have cost the lives of thousands of US soldiers. Why? Money and power.

Saddam is gone...why are we still in Iraq? Peacekeeping? Bullsh!t. We are stuck in a new Vietnam. Next thing you know, they're going to start calling it a police-action.
I don't blame the soldiers; they have a job to do. I do blame our government, and all the money/power hungry politicos that started this fiasco.

For the facts on the war, click this link.....
Fact Sheet