Weapons Platform Balancing

Right now, my concerns are more for the computer's sake than for players. The AI is not yet adept at building large fleets or performing adequate defense.

Guass cannon weapons platforms are too overpowered in the early game and too underpowered in the late game. They need to scale better. They need to start with a smaller amount of damage in the early game. Then, through research, they should be able to gain more damage and a faster rate of fire. They should also gain the ability to use shields and improved armor.

The hangers are too underpowered. For 4 tactical slots, I would expect at least 4 squadrons. I would also expect that a planet could host a lot more squadrons than 4 or 8. I would like to see a research option to research a huge hanger deck that could host 20 squadrons. Since this would be for late-game use to help defend against large fleets, I think it should take only 10 tactical slots.

I would also like to see mine fields in the game. I am thinking that in mid-to-late-game research, an option should open up to research a mine field generator. Once built, the mine field generator would slowly build a minefield surrounding the entire gravity well. The idea would be that the generator builds a spherical field of mines around the gravity well. The player should be able to choose where it starts building mines, and it should build in a clockwise direction. Over maybe 10-20 minutes, it would build an entire minefield. The point of the minefield would be to help defend against large numbers of ships. The mines should be strong enough to at least take out the shields of any ships passing through the mine field. As mines are used up, the mine field generator would slowly replace them. Friendly ships would not trigger mines, but would fly more slowly through the minefield than through normal space. This would also cost 10 tactical slots.

Finally, I would like to see some long-range ballastic missile batteries. These would be high-damage, long-range weapons platforms. They would carry maybe 20 missles and fire at a rate of 5 missles every 5 seconds. It would recharge 1 missle every 30 seconds. So, it would take about 10 minutes to fully recharge the missile platforms. The idea behind these would be to make them much more powerful than the gauss cannon platforms, but have limited ammunition so that people don't rely exclusively on these. They would be used to take out capital ships or other large ships that attack a system. It would help equalize the fight against a large fleet. In 20 seconds, they would deplete their weapons and then be basicly useless for the rest of the battle. But, they would deal enough of an initial blow to hopefully give the system a fighting chance against a large fleet. My only concerns with this type of platform are how to program when to fire and who to fire at. Ideally, they would wait for any in-bound capital ships to arrive and then target those. Their missiles should be able to aquire a new target if their original target is destroyed. That way they are not wasted. I think maybe 3 slots for each platform would be ideal.

So, a fully developed system with 35 tactical slots might look like this:

1 huge hanger deck with 20 squadrons (10 slots)
1 minefield generator (10 slots)
2 long range missile platforms ( 6 slots)
1 planetary shield ( 2 slots)
1 repair platform ( 2 slots)
5 gauss cannons ( 5 slots)

That would use all 35 slots and would offer some pretty beefy defenses against a large fleet.

A fleet attacking this planet would go something like this:

Initial ships (frigates) arrive, capital ships still in phase jump.
Fighters and bombers aquire targets and attack.
Initial ships start passing through minefield getting their shields knocked out and possibly one or two being completely destroyed.
Gauss cannons acquire targets on smaller ships and open fire.
Capital ships arrive.
Long range missle platforms target a single capital ship and open fire. Over the course of 20 seconds, they destroy one capital ship and critically wound another.
If the critically wounded capital ship passes through the minefield, it might die depending on the route it takes. If it goes through where other ships already passed, it might be fine because most of the mines have been used in that area. However, since it is larger, it may still take enough hits to be destroyed.
Gauss cannons, fighters, and bombers continue to pluck away at the frigates.
Finally, backup support arrives and ships engage the enemy. Ships have to get to the enemy, so they have to pass through the other side of the minefield at a slower rate of speed.
6,942 views 15 replies
Reply #1 Top
yea i agree but make the minfield realy weak and i do like the idea of huge hamgar bays and a planet would use all it had to defend it self they would have 100s of fighter squads not 4
Reply #2 Top
I agree, late game the platforms provide very little real defense... Well at least against my superior fleets
Reply #3 Top
I think your scenario there puts the defenses as way too powerful. This game is about the strategic placement of fleets, so with a good intelligence system, you should be able to see this large enemy fleet coming, and use your own fleet to defend. The static defenses should not kill most of a fleet on its own before a defensive fleet even arrives. This would make it much too difficult to attack a planet.
Reply #4 Top
I dont think what the OP has in mind would be overpowered. You have to consider that your invasion fleet will more than likely have flak frigs, and if they dont then you deserve to be bombed to death by the defense bombers. This is like a tier 2 planetary defense system. Which would obviously be much more expensive to research, and build. This would be excellent for defending your capitol, or that precious crystal world, but i wouldnt use it to defend all of my worlds because of the expense involved.

The state of the static defenses now is that if you max your slots out they will easily repel a pirate attack. However they dont stand a chance vs a coordinated capitol ship assault. If your fleet is too far away to respond you can kiss that world goodbye. I agree with Strattegi that defenses shouldnt be able to kill off a major cap ship assault on their own, but they should be able to tie them up long enough for your fleets to arrive (depending on how far away they are).

My late game fleets consist of at least one of each type of cap ship in the group. Plus about 5 light carriers, and a mix of everything else, and i dont invade any world without at least 10 flak frigs in my group, because the AI loves light carriers, and hangers so much. The AI are complete pushovers when it comes to planetary assaults as the game is now, and this is pretty much what we want to buff up. So this idea does have merit.
Reply #5 Top
Keep in mind, in the example I gave, the missles only destroy one of maybe 5 capital ships and critically wound one more. That still leaves 3 completely intact capital ships to fend off, plus whatever else has survived the mines, fighters, and gauss cannons. Based on my fleets, that still leaves a lot of ships to destroy. You would still need to bring in your own fleet to fully save the planet.
Reply #6 Top
You would still need to bring in your own fleet to fully save the planet.


That is the point, you still need fleets to defend yourself. Every game I play I have at least 2-3 fleets along the frontlines for defense. And 1-2 fleets for attack and advancement.

Reply #7 Top
I think a fair bump to platforms would be to make a research talent to make them marginally mobile. Original deployment is strategically valuable so they can participate in a fleet battle for space superiority, but perfectly useful defense installations won't forever sit and hum a happy tune as the planet is being slowly bombed to death from a marginal attack force on the other 3/4ths of the planet which they don't originally cover(the reason I can't stand building the damned things).
Reply #8 Top
I think that all of you are forgetting how inexpensive defense platforms are. What can you really expect for the price of a cobalt?
Reply #9 Top
I think that all of you are forgetting how inexpensive defense platforms are. What can you really expect for the price of a cobalt?
End of quote


Please note all of the discussion in this post was back in beta, with the original topic spawning in 2007 :P
Reply #10 Top
This one is more than a year old. :NOTSURE:
Reply #11 Top
Yeah. The Beta Feedback boards were never purged from the actual game beta ;) There's bound to be some fun stuff locked away here..
Reply #12 Top
The original post references minefield generators: did SINS have these or something similar at some point (in beta)???

Reply #13 Top
No :P But they've been pitched since beta ;)
Reply #14 Top
That's okay, since I finished my mine functionality Thursday (and gave myself the "Boom-Da-Yada" achievement :CONGRAT: couldn't resist :) I wanted to test it to be sure and not declare early victory like I did a few weeks ago with my glorified homing missiles :)

They are a near-perfect, fully featured implementation...
Here's what my mines do...

ANY ship entering it's activation radius triggers the mine to explode
Fighters do not trigger the mines (wasteful of 1000 damage points)
Ships do not lock onto it with normal weapons, at all
Damaging the mine with abilities triggers it to explode
Player spawned mines drift

When it explodes:
It destroys itself in a timely fashion (while ships are still in radius)
Damages/destroys all ships in range, with 5 damage levels/radii

Problems: (I'll tell you these too)
Neutral world minefields don't drift (unless their ability is interrupted)
They like to explode when or just after the ships start to explode, so I'll fix timing... (1.1 may fix this?)

I sent a fleet consisting of one of every ship in SINS from every race through in a tight formation, and they only made it half way through the gravity well before they were all destroyed, and it only took 18 mines, so now I know why they didn't put it into the game, they are overpowered and break the game.

It's fun to send big fleets through to see them explode, and it's a great way to test and compare explosion effects! (I may rely on SINS 1.1 explosions since I have heard they are much improved)

I still have lots of time to fill out the mine system and infrastructure, and will wait for 1.1 to merge with the fileset, squash bugs, and make them better/fuller...


Boom-Da-Yada!!!
Reply #15 Top
OOPS, I need to clarify:

ANY ENEMY ship entering it's activation radius triggers explosion!

(it would be silly for friendlies to blow themselves up! :) :D