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To Heck With the Food Stamps, I'm Mad about the Manicures!

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To Heck With the Food Stamps, I'm Mad about the Manicures!

Messed Up Priorities

from JoeUser Forums
There has been a lot of talk about the rules and regulations regarding food stamps. A lot of us seem to experience the same observation, these women tend to have beautiful nails! *Notice I didn't say they all have* I would love to have beautiful nails. I don't. You know why? I don't have the time because I am taking care of my home and family!

Before children, I would get acrylic nails because I have a hard time growing my own. It is expensive and very time intensive. You have to sit there for at least an hour every week to two weeks. You have to make it a priority. Once I had kids, it simply wasn't a priority anymore.

I am wondering A)How do these women afford it? and B)Why is it they have time to sit on their butts getting their nails done?

I am sure I will get the "They deserve to feel normal too" argument. Manicures are another luxury item. Not a necessity at all! Designer clothes and coiffed hair, more luxuries. Seem to see a lot of those accompanying food stamps too.

Even seeing an example of this once (which I have seen much more than that) is enough to make you feel a bit bitter about paying for these peoples' groceries. People who deserve the assistance can feel defensive about people citing these instances, but it is one of those frustrating flaws in the system. I have so much respect for the woman with the calculator and pile of coupons in tote as she shops. She plans out a list, estimates the cost and sticks to her plan. I can't say I have ever seen a food stamp user ever reference a list or use a coupon. That is just my experience though.

Another thing I can't figure out is the cell phones. How is it they have cell phones too? Example I saw yesterday, leather coat, designer glasses, manicured nails, talking on the cell while yelling at 3 kids to stay out of the candy. All 3 kids had new sneakers, designer clothes and new coats.

I'm all for helping the needy. I am all for seeing kids get the nourishment and clothing they need. I am not for paying for luxuries I don't even have for myself or my family. My family is buying sneakers from Pay-Less and they are wearing Nikes. That just isn't right.

I am not sure how we are going to get there, but I think somehow our society needs to return to the times when people were proud to make the best of what they could with what they had. They would do anything they could to avoid hand outs. Anyone who doesn't believe that government assistance is a handout is fooling themselves. It used to be people were fine working their way up. Now any job other than the top is beneath them. Why work for less than you can make getting assistance? I'll tell you why, you can start a work record and work toward better jobs. Gain experience. Learn new things. Do for yourself and see how rewarding it is. That is how I was raised and it has worked out pretty well so far.
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Reply #51 from JoeUser Forums Top

B) I never made more than $25000/yr. working full time as an elementary teacher. That's the average in the area where I lived. And how many months a year we work is irrelevant, as in my district we got PAID twelve months out of the year, not just during the months we worked.

Why the other months off was relevant is that you can work at another job during that time.

at the college he attended, the majority of the classes were only offered during the day...

Again, you are pointing out another choice. 

I understand that you have totally reasoned with yourself that you used food stamps as they were intended.  But, you have to understand that *many* people do not agree.  Food stamps are there to keep people from starving. 

You say that your husband was working for $5.00 an hour.  What prevented him from getting a different job?  You say that 2 of your kids were from a previous marriage, did you not receive child support for them?

 

Oh, and Janders, your post is right on with my thinking.

Reply #52 from JoeUser Forums Top
Why the other months off was relevant is that you can work at another job during that time.

And spend most of what I made paying for child care for three children? It wasn't financially prudent for us to do that..however, my husband DID work full time during the summer instead of only 20 hr weeks, so we did have extra money during that time.
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Reply #53 from JoeUser Forums Top
What prevented him from getting a different job? You say that 2 of your kids were from a previous marriage, did you not receive child support for them?

Yes, I did...but fifty dollars a month doesn't go far for two school age children.....and that's total, not per child.....you see, their father wasn't working, either.
Reply #55 from JoeUser Forums Top

And spend most of what I made paying for child care for three children? It wasn't financially prudent for us to do that..however, my husband DID work full time during the summer instead of only 20 hr weeks, so we did have extra money during that time.

No offense but welcome to the real world. I mean, this is something the rest of us have to face every day. It doesn't mean teachers should somehow get paid even more.

Just so that we're clear: I don't think you're bad or immoral or anything like that. I just don't think welfare programs should be used in the way you used them. They are supposed to be a temporary safety net while you get on your feet.  Using them as a means to pay for college is not what I think most people had in mind. If everyone did as you did, our economy would come to a screeching halt. 

You made decisions based on the existence of welfare. That's the problem. Rather than acting like a safety net, you used welfare as a springboard.  I'd have no problem if there were government programs designed to help people go to school or whatever.

Wisefawn: Yes, PoetMom's example discredits your arguments very effectively. Why? Because you claimed how we're not doing enough for the poor. And yet here you have a clear cut example of people who could have avoided being on food stamps if they had made different choices. Her husband did not need to stay at a $5 per hour job. I mean, for crying out loud, *I* made $8 per hour back in high school driving a van around for the bank and that was probably around the same time. Two people working full time should be able to pay for 3 children.  But listen to what PoetMom has said: They need $600 per month just in food. Come on, that's ridiculous. No attempt at going without there. 

The welfare programs are currently so lax and so flexible that people can be on them, go to school for FOUR years while still spending $600 per month just on food. That's precisely why I'm against spending more on these programs. If there's so much money to go around as-is that this scenario occurs -- on that you, Wisefawn, applaud, then I can only imagine what would happen if we threw even more money at it.

Those of us who struggled our way through college ON OUR OWN tend to resent the idea that we did so that we coudl later bear the burden of people who wanted mother government to pay for other people to use welfare and food stamps to subsidize someone else's eventual rise to being a college professor.  Professor of what btw? It better not be philosophy or political science or history where he's espousing his political views to his students.

At the end of the day, the question is this: Without welfare, would PoetMom's family have starved? No. They would have just had to make different choices. Therefore, they shouldn't have gotten welfare. It's not supposed to be used that way.

Reply #56 from JoeUser Forums Top

True, Brad, very true.  Considering that I lived on $15 - $20 a week in groceries for almost 2 years ($20 was with "spcial occasion" stuff), I have to agree that $600 a week for a family of 5 is insane.  That becomes a lifestyle choice, not a need.

But, in general, it appears that people really can't see the difference between "need" and "want".

 

Reply #57 from JoeUser Forums Top
I have to agree that $600 a week for a family of 5 is insane


Did you mean a week, or a month??? Either way, that's still more than I spent on all 5 of us!! That's insane!! Our average grocery bill is $400 a month, and we eat well...I cannot imagine spending $600 on food (and remember that if that's food stamp funds you can't buy toiletries, paper goods etc with that money - it all has to be spent on edible items)

But, in general, it appears that people really can't see the difference between "need" and "want".


I think that you hit the nail on the head there.
Reply #58 from JoeUser Forums Top
oops, sorry, I meant a month... should have drank more coffee before posting
Reply #59 from JoeUser Forums Top
Dharma, she said earlier that she got just over $300 in food stamps, and paid for the rest out of pocket.  Since you have a family of 5, do you think, that if you had to, that you could feed them on $300 (that's just food)?  I know that I feed my family on less than that, and my husband is like having 3 teenaged boys   But, I know that about half my food bill is stuff that I want, not need.
Reply #60 from JoeUser Forums Top
Since you have a family of 5, do you think, that if you had to, that you could feed them on $300 (that's just food)?


Yes. We have in the past, when we were broke. I'd make up a menu plan for the 2 week period between paydays, and then only buy what was needed for the plan. Everybody ate well; actually we all ate more healthily because we cut out all the junk and convienience items. I'm not talking about ramen noodles for supper every night either, we had meals that were based on the USDA food pyramid, and we usually had left overs...for example, if we had chili one night then we'd have chili dogs for lunch the next day, thereby using up the leftovers. Planning like that allowed us to spend less - less of OUR money.

Reply #61 from JoeUser Forums Top
Dharma, I make meal plans even now.  I'm just spoiled and eat more elaborate meals than I need.  However, during times that money is tight (like when car insurance is due, property taxes, etc.) I have ways of getting my food bill way down.  Planning around grocery sales is one of them, as well as buying bulk (like ground beef is cheaper in larger quantities, you then just have to break it up and freeze it).  i also have super cheap but nutritious meals like my spinach, rice and cheese dish.  You take a bunch of rice (which probably ends up about $.50 for 6 servings), a package of spinach ($.99 for the "good stuff) and 1/4 of a large thing of Velveeta ($1.10) and milk to thin the cheese ($.25).  So, you have 6 generous servings (which ends up providing lunch for my husband and I also) for less than $3.00.  That is $.50 a serving and it is healthy and filling (veggie, protein, and carbs all in one yummy package).  But, I have a feeling a lot of people don't cook, and they won't eat "cheap" meals.  When needed, I get my grocery bill (including household products) under $50.  You would be amazed at how much veggie soup you can make for cheap.  It's filling, good for you, and cuts down how much "other" food you need....mmmmmm....I wish I had a bowl of that right now.......
Reply #62 from JoeUser Forums Top
I do too, Karma,and I pin it on the fridge. It allows me to spend less on food, and everyone knows 'what's for supper', causing less arguments about who wants what to eat.

Ooohhh, I like the spinach cheese and rice idea. I'm going to have to try that one. I also draw from my mother's teachings...we traditionally had a roast on sundays, and leftovers on Mondays. She made 'bubble and squeak' - leftover mashed potatoes and cabbage, mixed together and fried in a little oil until they're browned, then topped with a bit of shredded cheese. Sounds funky, but tastes really good! If we have roast chicken I'll save the carcass and make stock out of it, then throw in the leftover meat, a few veggies and some egg noddles and voila! Home made chicken noodle soup...tastes better than the canned stuff, and is more nutritious.
Reply #63 from JoeUser Forums Top

never heard of the "bubble and squeak" but I may have to try it (I love potatoes...)  It's funny, you sound like your household runs the same as mine.  I love the meal plan on the fridge.  My mother in law thinks I'm insane for doing it.  But, it really keeps my shopping to a minimum and I hardly ever have to throw out food.  Simplifies the shopping process, too, and I hate shopping so that makes me happy!

Home made soup is so much better for you.  Just read the sodium content on canned soup.  Ack...it's high blood pressure in a can.

Reply #64 from JoeUser Forums Top
Kole and I spend approximately 100/m Cnd on food and supplies. I actually like grocery shopping in order to see how much I can get for so little money. Our staples are rice and egg dishes, plus, I've learned how to make bread, which is sooo cheap. We eat a lot of tuna in place of red meat, and it pretty much goes with anything... pasta, rice, in sandwiches, soufles. Our produce that we get is also cheap and I've gotten her into the habit of thinking that fruit is as much of a treat as sugary junk food. I like that you guys are sharing recipe ideas. Any more?
Reply #65 from JoeUser Forums Top
My grandma grew up during the depression and can make a casserole out of anything. Here is the Master Casserole Recipe

1/3 cooked meat, fish, cheese or hard cooked egg
1/3 sauce, soup or gravy
1/3 cooked potatos, vegetables, rice or pasta

mix together, season to taste, cover and bake at 400 degrees until top looks browned (about 40-50mins) Voila, cheap and easy meal.
Reply #66 from JoeUser Forums Top

1 package mac and cheese (I like the shells kind for this)
1/2 bag defrosted frozen broccoli (can use fresh, too, it just takes longer to cook)
8 oz mushrooms
1/2 cup sour cream

make macaroni to package directions.  Slice and lightly cook mushrooms.  Mix all ingredients in casserole and cook at 350 degrees for about 20 minutes.  Cheap, easy, and fairly healthy.  A salad on the side is a nice compliment.

Reply #67 from JoeUser Forums Top
Some choices made are bad choices. I own up to mine.
My ex-husband and I got married when I was 16. My son was born, I was 17 years old. Ok, my choices. I didn't see any other alternatives at the time. He wouldn't "allow " me to finish night school to get my GED. I had to work instead. (Jerk) < lessons learned. A year later, we divorced, and he got everything, including our son.< my choice, no excuses. Lesson learned.
I had another son, two years later. All the while working a full time job and supporting myself and my boys.(I paid child support too) We did just fine for awhile.
Some years later, I decided to go back to school, tired of working dead end jobs. I couldn't get financed for community college, so I tried a trade school...of sorts. I took Cosmetology.(mistake3) I was working full time, plus some. I was going to school nights. I couldn't keep up with work and school. I was getting about 4 hours of sleep a day. I eventually cut my hours at work, mostly just the overtime, and got on food stamps for me and my youngest son. I only recieved $243. a month. I was only able to get that much as long as I was working and going to school. Right after I graduated, I no longer accepted food stamps. I didn't wait until I found a job, or waited until it ran out in 2 more months. I stopped it immediately.
If it wasn't for the system, I would not be as productive as I am now. I give back to the community, more than I did back then.
Most of you probably believe what I did was wrong, but I used the system as intended. It is there to "give a leg up "
I don't believe it's there to give more than that though. Like, furthering your education.
It is there to help people get their GED's or go to a trade school to join the working world. Maybe to START a career, but not to finish a graduate school.
Reply #68 from JoeUser Forums Top
how long were you on it, though?
Reply #69 from JoeUser Forums Top

I was looking at what I've eaten today.

Breakfast: Oat meal, grape fruice, orange juice. Total cost: ~$.35

Lunch: 2 Peanut butter and Jelly sandwiches: ~$.20

Dinner: Left over chicken, salad: ~$1.00

That's pretty typical for me.  Let's say though I got that up to $2 per day to take care of unusual days. That would be $60 per month.  I don't have to life taht way, I can afford more and we often do get other goodies like fresh fruits, wine, roast. But there's no way we'd get up to $600 per month with 5 people.

If you don't eat out, food is dirt cheap.

What pains me is that I actually do support having a social safety net. But I want that safety net distinctly defined: No American should go hungry or have no shelter. We're a rich nation.  But if you're going hungry in the United States, it's probably a failure of common sense, not a failure in the system.

I also support very generous grants for schooling. It should come in the form of tuition grants for those who are a) needy and b) keep a very high grade point average while in school (i.e. 3.0 or better).

But there should be limits on many of these things. 4 years collecting food stamps (as poetmom mentioned) seems to me to be way too long.

Reply #70 from JoeUser Forums Top
I really don't see why anyone should need them past a year.  After that, it can't really be considered temporary.  I also don't think that people who can't work because they are going to school should get food stamps.  I think that they should get a very low interest loan even though they have no money that they can use for school (have to maintain a passable GPA to collect) and for things that they *need*.  They then can really pay back what they owe.
Reply #72 from JoeUser Forums Top
In the state of NM you are required to re-apply for assistance every 3 months. That way they can keep a closer eye on you. Thinking about it, I was probably on it for a shorter period of time. I remember applying only twice. It hardly worked though. (the check up system)
While at school, I learned a lot....so many of the women there were on full welfare, recieving full benefits. All of them, and I mean, ALL of them were able to work. Hello! If your able to go to school to learn a trade.....I think you can work! What are you going to do when you graduate? Now that is definitely abusing the system.
My biggest issue, was that most of them hardly spoke a word of English. (illegal aliens)
Reply #74 from JoeUser Forums Top

hood rich

Huh?  Can you explain what that means?  I think I know...but I'm living the white-bread-vanilla-flavored life at the moment and am not familiar with the terminology...

Reply #75 from JoeUser Forums Top


I'd like to add a bit of insight into this debate , because some of these comments are just unreal.

I used to work in "the ghetto" . Sometimes the things I heard and saw just amazed me , but for the most part, I saw a loving Community that had some major flaws, no matter what the blame or share of blame. I also learned that, at the time , MOST of the people on welfare were white.

This didn't matter to me , because being in need is being in need. Yes, some "milk it " ,and most don't. Rules have tightened up on welfare and food stamps , so it's harder , but not impossible to defraud.

There's a Church here that serves the homeless , and they do it in style . They are amazing. They ask for donations from Corporations , and clothing. BUT , they don't want used clothing , they want new, name brand clothing - and they get it. WHY?

As their Pastor says : These people have very little , sometimes nothing. The lift in their esteem , especially for the children , when they are fed , and get a nice new pair of shoes - cannot be measured. The smiles and the tears are proof enough.

Some of these people have a great deal of pride. Dressing up for Church is important. And possibly dressing nice while they use their food stamps ( an embarrassing thing for many ) is important , too.

As for the nails , many women, especially the Black community , have parties at home where they do this themselves. It's just another part of the looking nice . It's not costly if there's no labor.

As for the tax dollars, I pay taxes too, and so do others , so just pretend that I am paying for it , and not you. We're talking pennies here, folks. You spend more on Lattes.

Many many years ago , I lost my job, as did my friend , for no reason other than our company benefits would soon be free. The company had a history of this, so we filed for unemployment. Worried about money until the unemployment came ( if we got it at all ) , we applied for food stamps as a one time thing , which we received.

I have never been so embarrassed than using those stamps , but we had to. Everything worked out fine. Remember - usually the percentage of people abusing the system
is really quite small.